.mac ... are you going to do it?

[griffman]

It looks like I'm in for most of the first year, as I just upgraded my iDisk capacity about two months ago ... for $49, I was considering it.

For $99, I'll require complete control over my email and no limits on page hits on my site. If those two things happen, it's a bargain for me -- the 20,000 downloads of my OS X Solutions Guidebook from mac.com probably saved me somewhere around $150 in bandwidth charges on macosxhints.com!

-rob.

[bluehz]

Hear! Hear! At the VERY LEAST!!!

Quote: Originally posted by griffman I'll require complete control over my email and no limits on page hits on my site.

[wayneyoung]

Phil,
Thanks for asking. However, I don't really have a problem with 10.2, I was really looking forward to getting the next version of OSX with features we have all been looking for this past year or so, and hopefully the death of a few remaining bugs. I can't see paying full price for a point upgrade either. This is also one reason I left the Wintel world three years ago. I was constantly upgrading my software just to get a more stable system. Mac is different though, because with 10.1.5 my system is stable, I can do what I need to do, and I am reasonably satisfied, but I doubt any of the bugs remaining will be fixed unless I go to 10.2, and of course, a whole new set of bugs will be introduced, and we will all be looking for 10.2.x before long. Anyway, I hope Apple tells us soon there will be an inexpensive upgrade to 10.2, or I may stick with 10.1.5 for quite a while.

Wayne

[Phil St. Romain]

I hear you wayne. There are a lot of missing features (from OS 9) finally added back in 10.2, but it seems to me there are many, many more new features as well. When I consider that the jump from OS 8 to 8.5 was considered a fell upgrade without much to show for it (OK, Sherlock and ASM, mainly), I think this is a much better deal.

As for the point upgrade, my guess is that we're on a new scale now. An upgrade of this magnitude would be .5 or even 1.0 addition. Apple apparently wants to stay in that X-zone for quite awhile. It may take decades to finally get to OS 11.

[JayBee]

Just to let you guys know, it looks like there IS a free mail-only option for .mac:

Quote: Converting your .Mac trial account to an email-only account IMPORTANT: If you choose to convert your trial account to an email-only account, all your data files on Apple's servers (except for email messages) will be removed. Other .Mac services, such as iDisk, HomePage, Backup, and Virex, are not accessible to email-only accounts. To convert your trial account to email-only, go to www.mac.com. Click Account in the .Mac menu bar, then click the Email Account Management button. Enter the member name and password of the trial account you'd like to convert, then click Convert. Print your account information for future reference, then click Continue.

This was snagged from .mac's help section, under "email" - it's right at the bottom of the list of options you get.

What I want to know is whether this action kills my chance to update for $49. Also, what I really want to know is how much this is going to cost in the UK. Going to the .mac section on the UK apple site just takes me to the US version...

As for Jaguar... I'm thinking £99 is pretty reasonable. This ain't no "point" release in the traditional sense. I now see what apple's numbering policy is. As they've said all along, the X/10 part IS the operating system. It's "Mac OS X", not "Mac OS, version 10". Looks like 10.2 ain't no point release - it's a version jump. 8-9 stylee.

However, I DO want a damned upgrade price. I don't hold with the "I've been beta testing! 10.2 is the real deal" stuff, but I do reckon that an upgrade policy is standard practice. Nobody expects an upgrade price for Dreamweaver MX "because v4 was just a beta, really", they expect it because they are existing customers, and expect to be treated a little better by a company they've already given money to.

Regardless, I'll still be buying it. I'll just be a bit miffed.

On the plus side, a system reinstall won't require 3 disks (10.0 -> 10.1 -> 10.2) with a shiny new full release copy

[Markle]

Phil: "As for .mac, it just seems to me that Apple has decided that the PR benefits of iTools no longer justifies the expense they're putting out for it. And now that "everyone else is doing it" (making money), well, why not?"

Here's the scenario I see: Those who bought into the Mac or upgraded in reliance on the promise of iTools start a class action, which gets settled by Apple giving a big concession on .Mac to those who can prove they bought in during the time the offer and promise was/were being made.

Apple always had the reputation of being a little nicer than the hard-assed Microsoft. They've been chipping away at that PR advantage for a while now, and this latest slap doesn't do them any good at all.

Markle

[Phil St. Romain]

Markle, you know any lawyer we might contact?

[Markle]

Quote: Originally posted by JayBee ...I DO want a damned upgrade price. I don't hold with the "I've been beta testing! 10.2 is the real deal" stuff, but I do reckon that an upgrade policy is standard practice. Nobody expects an upgrade price for Dreamweaver MX "because v4 was just a beta, really", they expect it because they are existing customers, and expect to be treated a little better by a company they've already given money to. What you expect and what you get aren't always the same thing. This is the company that got people to pay it for the privilege of beta testing its software. Why should it go soft now? Regardless, I'll still be buying it. I'll just be a bit miffed.

Therein lies the problem--people continuing to give Apple money no matter what it does. How does Apple know that you're miffed? Your checkbook says otherwise.

Markle

[Markle]

Quote: Originally posted by Phil St. Romain Markle, you know any lawyer we might contact?

Ha! I should give it some thought, Phil. The referral fee would be huge!

Markle

[Craig R. Arko]

Ah, class action: the mating cry of the J.D.

Hey JayBee, I'm having trouble finding that link you refer to. Can you give more instruction on where to find that? All I can find is a reference to adding mail-only accounts for $10/year to an existing .Mac account.

Apple would be smart, I think, to consider giving existing iTools users the option of converting to email only, even if it is $10/year.

[JayBee]

Quote: Originally posted by Markle Therein lies the problem--people continuing to give Apple money no matter what it does. How does Apple know that you're miffed? Your checkbook says otherwise. Markle

Indeed. I think a few emails are going to be sent airing the views. At the end of the day, though, when it comes to Jaguar, they don't really have any obligation other than goodwill to provide an upgrade price. £99 is within my budget (and around what I figured they'd charge anyway). I'm not protesting too much about it, as they have a product I want at a price I must admit is reasonable, if not ideal. I want it, they got it, and really I don't have much to complain about except their lack of goodwill.

However, .mac is something totally different. $49 (or whatever they end up charging us UK bods) is out of my budget for what I use it for - email. I'll have to wait and see whether I use any of the other stuff before I can make a judgement, but regardless - shutting off access to a cut-down free version makes my blood boil. Especially when (as I noted), they actually seem to be offering a free version, but going to great pains to hide it from view.

Email addresses are very tricky things. I've just gone around telling everyone to use my mac.com address if they want to contact me - I've gone to great pains to hide it from spammers and keep it "clean". It's my personal address, as opposed to my work address.

And now mac seems to want me to go around all my friends and say "Actually, I've had to cancel the mac.com address cos they decided to try and sting me $100 per year for it". Great PR, eh?

[JayBee]

Phil ... [edit - you're not Phil! You're Craig!] Here's the link.

To find this, go to mac.com, then click on "help" in the top bar. Select "On the desktop" under the "Email at mac.com" header in the window that pops up.

Theres now a list of help items in a scrolling frame. Scroll right to the bottom, past the "Adding", "Editing" and "Moving" items that refer to the $10 per email accounts, and click on "Converting your .Mac trial account to an email-only account".

Admittedly, it doesn't actually specify "free"... might send off another email about this...

[dsk]

Quote: To convert your trial account to email-only, go to www.mac.com. Click Account in the .Mac menu bar, then click the Email Account Management button. Enter the member name and password of the trial account you'd like to convert, then click Convert.

Actually, I can't even find what the hell they are talking about. Can anyone find "Email Account Management"?

David

[Craig R. Arko]

Thanks! I'm the 'other' Phil now (Lerk used to be the 'other' Phil but we traded shifts).

This would be a good thing if you can just do this switch. Anybody wanna try it and see if it works?

[melg]

- Poll question by griffman - This opening post from a merged thread -

--------

Apple has decided to start charging for its iTools replacement .Mac. With a price tag of $100 for a year and $50 for present users (up until September).

I've had a mac.com email address for a few years now and had no problem allowing Apple to get free advertising via my email address for the price they were charging (i.e. no charge).

However, given the new pricing structure, I think may give up my mac.com address. Sure, you get additional space and some software, but none of the extras appeal to anything I need (I'm on dial-up).

Before I decide, however, I'd like to hear from others about whether you will be sticking with .Mac or not and why.

Mel

[Markle]

JayBee: "At the end of the day, though, when it comes to Jaguar, they don't really have any obligation other than goodwill to provide an upgrade price."

Some might say that this view only encourages software publishers to take their time fixing bugs, doing only a few at a time so they can charge for each edition of the fixes.

In the end, of course, everybody is entitled to make their own decisions about what they're willing to accept, and what they're willing to pay for.

Markle

[JayBee]

hmm. Snake oil tastic.

Anyone actually know how to CONTACT Apple? I've been doing the pillar-to-post rounds on the site for a while - I just want an email address or a form to give them some feedback, but it looks like they've closed the blast doors

[wayneyoung]

For feedback to Apple, this site is still available. http://www.apple.com/macosx/feedback/

[dvice]

I plan to switch for a few reasons.

iTools / .Mac on OSX and a high speed connection, is finally fast enough for me to be practical. Before, I liked the idea of iTools, but everything took to long. I had just recently been exploring iTool again when I updated OSX and was suprized at the increase in speed.

Maintaining the family web site will be much easier. My families web site has not been updated in three years because as a web designer, the last thing I want to do is come home a work on another web site. But with iPhoto and .Mac, I will be able to keep the relatives happy without having to mess with a lot of code.

Streaming videos work very well, my wife's business has recently needed to post a streaming movie to the web quickly, the solution was quick and simple, iMovie to QuickTime to iTools. We beat the socks off a compeditor in turn-around time, one day, start to finish.

So, while I wish dial-up was included in the price (what we have at home), I think these reasons are worth it for me, not to mention the other features which Apple has brought to the bargain.

[mervTormel]

.mac specific feedback page...