Webcams Activated by School on Student Macs - Page 8

Jay Carr · 06-29-2010, 01:01 PM

It definitely doesn't look good that there were internal complaints that were completely ignored. I'm not sure what to think of this myself...

In this particular case, I think that the administration should have behaved differently. Even if it is true that the admin did not know what was going on for a while, they clearly did know when they reviewed the images of the young man in question (did they think the images appeared by magic?). At that point they should have halted, or at least reviewed, the program, rather than using it as evidence. At very very least, I would have requested legal guidance on the issue.

aehurst · 06-29-2010, 01:13 PM

The "take a deep breath and relax" comment to a concerned parent kinda says it all, doesn't it?

Once the asst principal and principal were made aware of the photos, they should have ended it right then and there, but did not. They are more guilty than the ITs, I think... of all the people who had knowledge and didn't react these are the guys who absolutely should have known better.

tlarkin · 06-29-2010, 02:00 PM

I already knew that was going to happen and i know what is going to happen next. Been working in academia long enough to know this sort of stuff.

ArcticStones · 06-29-2010, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by acme.mail.order


	As practically every phone in the country has a camera I wonder how long it will be before the two are combined? And what would Orwell think if he were alive today?

George would probably say that we’re behind the times.

fracai · 07-29-2010, 08:17 PM

More allegations:
http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...ndal-broadens/

aehurst · 07-29-2010, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fracai


	More allegations: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...ndal-broadens/

One would have thought by now that the attorneys would have nailed down every single photo taken, notified the affected individuals, and asked them to join in a class action suit.

This going to get ugly. It's time to OVER-REACT !!

NovaScotian · 07-29-2010, 08:53 PM

It actually got ugly a long time ago when the number of images taken was known. It continues to amaze me of events in the news in the US and Canada in which it is shown unequivocally a short time later that several key figures in the story were lying. Why, in these days of near-instant communication, does anyone think they can get away with lying for more than a few days?

fracai · 08-17-2010, 08:59 PM

Dodged a bullet here: Feds: No charges in Pa. school laptop-spying case

Basically, they determined that there was no "criminal intent".
Though it doesn't sound like the family suit is done, just that no Federal charges are being applied. Seems to me that even if there wasn't "intent", there was certainly negligence.

aehurst · 08-18-2010, 09:06 AM

Sounds reasonable. Confident state and local authorities will determine the same.

Still, I hope the family suit prevails enough to get people's attention... well intended or not, you don't spy in the family home. Privacy matters!

NovaScotian · 08-18-2010, 10:01 AM

No criminal intent implies that storing the pictures was an automatic or unintentional consequence of leaving cameras activated when they should have been shut off.

renaultssoftware · 08-18-2010, 10:03 AM

The iPhone 4 has two cameras. Perfect for finding both sides. Just put it in front of your car to make sure there's nothing coming.

aehurst · 10-12-2010, 08:56 AM

School district settled for big bucks. $600k to one student, $10k to another. Lawyers got the biggest slice of the million dollar + pie. Go figure.

A court decision might have been a better outcome because then we'd have a good idea what the rules are.

acme.mail.order · 10-12-2010, 09:22 AM

But money talks. A million-dollar settlement will certainly get the attention of anyone else thinking about the same thing.

tlarkin · 10-12-2010, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aehurst


	School district settled for big bucks. $600k to one student, $10k to another. Lawyers got the biggest slice of the million dollar + pie. Go figure. A court decision might have been a better outcome because then we'd have a good idea what the rules are.

ridiculous

aehurst · 10-12-2010, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlarkin


	ridiculous

If you are referring to the $ amount of the settlement, I agree. $600k sounds way out of line with the actual damages, if any.

In these kinds of cases, most often the insurance company attorneys represent the party being sued. Their decision to settle will have nothing to do with right or wrong or rights of the parties, but will be a simple math calculation of what's the cheapest way out of this. Legal fees could have easily reached $1 million if litigated to the bitter end and then appealed.

Insurance company tells school to settle.... and if they don't settle, insurance company will say that is the limit of their liability, school takes any additional risks on their own dime. BIG hammer.

tlarkin · 10-12-2010, 10:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aehurst


	If you are referring to the $ amount of the settlement, I agree. $600k sounds way out of line with the actual damages, if any. In these kinds of cases, most often the insurance company attorneys represent the party being sued. Their decision to settle will have nothing to do with right or wrong or rights of the parties, but will be a simple math calculation of what's the cheapest way out of this. Legal fees could have easily reached $1 million if litigated to the bitter end and then appealed. Insurance company tells school to settle.... and if they don't settle, insurance company will say that is the limit of their liability, school takes any additional risks on their own dime. BIG hammer.

I think it should have gone to court to outline the rules of school property off campus. Also I think that the lawyers getting that big of a chunk is ridiculous, as there wasn't any major harm done.

Now, that college kid that found a GPS unit on him, and the FBI asked for it back. That should go to court, and someone should be fired, and there should be damages paid to that college kid. That is a different story though.

aehurst · 10-12-2010, 10:50 AM

It is most unfortunate that Civil Suits have little to do with right and wrong, it is always about money. Pay the money and the problem goes away. Sad.

fracai · 10-12-2010, 10:59 AM

The school likely settled because they thought going to court would be vastly more harmful to them in the long run. It probably would have and the school has the public to answer too. It's unfortunate that their actions necessitated so many tax dollars be diverted away from education; though the $600k kid is hopefully looking at a pretty nice college fund.

The FBI GPS case is already being looked at by the ACLU and will very likely go to court. I think the ACLU quote was something along the lines that they were eagerly waiting for a case like it to come along.

tlarkin · 10-12-2010, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fracai


	...The FBI GPS case is already being looked at by the ACLU and will very likely go to court. I think the ACLU quote was something along the lines that they were eagerly waiting for a case like it to come along.

Yeah the FBI has had a history of abusing power and gathering information in an illegal manner. They need to be put in their place and stop infringing on people's rights.

renaultssoftware · 10-12-2010, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aehurst


	It is most unfortunate that Civil Suits have little to do with right and wrong, it is always about money. Pay the money and the problem goes away. Sad.

"For the love of money is the root of all evil."

06-29-2010, 01:01 PM	#141
Jay Carr Hall of Famer Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Springfield, MO, USA Posts: 3,110	It definitely doesn't look good that there were internal complaints that were completely ignored. I'm not sure what to think of this myself... In this particular case, I think that the administration should have behaved differently. Even if it is true that the admin did not know what was going on for a while, they clearly did know when they reviewed the images of the young man in question (did they think the images appeared by magic?). At that point they should have halted, or at least reviewed, the program, rather than using it as evidence. At very very least, I would have requested legal guidance on the issue. __________________ ~ Long ago I was called Zalister, keep that in mind when reading responses to my old posts.

06-29-2010, 01:13 PM	#142
aehurst MVP Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sherwood, Arkansas, USA Posts: 1,320	The "take a deep breath and relax" comment to a concerned parent kinda says it all, doesn't it? Once the asst principal and principal were made aware of the photos, they should have ended it right then and there, but did not. They are more guilty than the ITs, I think... of all the people who had knowledge and didn't react these are the guys who absolutely should have known better. __________________ iMac, 2.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB

06-29-2010, 02:00 PM	#143
tlarkin League Commissioner Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 11,352	I already knew that was going to happen and i know what is going to happen next. Been working in academia long enough to know this sort of stuff. __________________ sudo make me a sammich

07-29-2010, 08:17 PM	#145
fracai MVP Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,100	More allegations: http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/201...ndal-broadens/
$fracai is offline$

07-29-2010, 08:53 PM	#147
NovaScotian League Commissioner Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Halifax, Canada Posts: 5,156	It actually got ugly a long time ago when the number of images taken was known. It continues to amaze me of events in the news in the US and Canada in which it is shown unequivocally a short time later that several key figures in the story were lying. Why, in these days of near-instant communication, does anyone think they can get away with lying for more than a few days? __________________ 17" MBP, OS X; 27" iMac, both OS X 10.10.x (latest)

08-17-2010, 08:59 PM	#148
fracai MVP Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,100	Dodged a bullet here: Feds: No charges in Pa. school laptop-spying case Basically, they determined that there was no "criminal intent". Though it doesn't sound like the family suit is done, just that no Federal charges are being applied. Seems to me that even if there wasn't "intent", there was certainly negligence.
$fracai is offline$

08-18-2010, 09:06 AM	#149
aehurst MVP Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sherwood, Arkansas, USA Posts: 1,320	Sounds reasonable. Confident state and local authorities will determine the same. Still, I hope the family suit prevails enough to get people's attention... well intended or not, you don't spy in the family home. Privacy matters! __________________ iMac, 2.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB

08-18-2010, 10:01 AM	#150
NovaScotian League Commissioner Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Halifax, Canada Posts: 5,156	No criminal intent implies that storing the pictures was an automatic or unintentional consequence of leaving cameras activated when they should have been shut off. __________________ 17" MBP, OS X; 27" iMac, both OS X 10.10.x (latest)

08-18-2010, 10:03 AM	#151
renaultssoftware MVP Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Pembroke, Ontario Posts: 2,051	The iPhone 4 has two cameras. Perfect for finding both sides. Just put it in front of your car to make sure there's nothing coming. __________________ Get Icon Creator and support me.

10-12-2010, 08:56 AM	#152
aehurst MVP Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sherwood, Arkansas, USA Posts: 1,320	School district settled for big bucks. $600k to one student, $10k to another. Lawyers got the biggest slice of the million dollar + pie. Go figure. A court decision might have been a better outcome because then we'd have a good idea what the rules are. __________________ iMac, 2.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB

10-12-2010, 09:22 AM	#153
acme.mail.order League Commissioner Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Tokyo Posts: 6,334	But money talks. A million-dollar settlement will certainly get the attention of anyone else thinking about the same thing.

10-12-2010, 10:50 AM	#157
aehurst MVP Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sherwood, Arkansas, USA Posts: 1,320	It is most unfortunate that Civil Suits have little to do with right and wrong, it is always about money. Pay the money and the problem goes away. Sad. __________________ iMac, 2.66 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, 4GB

10-12-2010, 10:59 AM	#158
fracai MVP Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,100	The school likely settled because they thought going to court would be vastly more harmful to them in the long run. It probably would have and the school has the public to answer too. It's unfortunate that their actions necessitated so many tax dollars be diverted away from education; though the $600k kid is hopefully looking at a pretty nice college fund. The FBI GPS case is already being looked at by the ACLU and will very likely go to court. I think the ACLU quote was something along the lines that they were eagerly waiting for a case like it to come along.
$fracai is offline$