why is available CD-R disk space 40 MB less in OS X than in OS 9?

loekjehe · 03-23-2002, 07:29 AM

If I want to burn a CD in OS X it says me the disk has 610 MB available (after inserting the disk and preparing it for burning). If I want to burn the same CD with Toast in OS 9, I have 654 MB available! I don't understand this difference. Does anybody else also have this problem? What should I do to get more disk space available in OS X on my CD's? I feel it is a waste of CD space to burn in OS X in this way and I feel now obliged to burn booting in OS 9 to be economical with my CD's. Is there something wrong with my computer? Any suggestions?

Auricchio · 03-23-2002, 01:45 PM

Are you using Toast in both cases?

I wouldn't be surprised if a Finder burn and a Toast burn were different.

mervTormel · 03-23-2002, 02:11 PM

i believe the disk copy utility has a preference setting for creating/preparing CD media. of the options, there is 610 and 660 MB for CD media.

try setting the disk copy preference, /creating\ tab, volume size: ( 660 MB ) and see if that preps a CD with the larger size for you.

Craig R. Arko · 03-23-2002, 05:02 PM

Possibly OS 9 is measuring in increments of K=1000 (e.g. 1MB = 1000KB) and OS X is measuring (correctly) in increments of 1024 (MB = 1024 KB)?

mervTormel · 03-23-2002, 05:49 PM

perhaps i'm wrong about the disk copy utility having anything to do with preparing CD media. ima dunno where i got that idea.

using my CD-R media, which is rated at 700MB capacity, if i select Standard (HFS Plus/ISO 6990) in the media prep dialog box, i get offered a 666.8MB CD-R. toast disk info tells me i have 702.8MB available.

perhaps there is some overhead pre-calculated by the OSX prepper that toast don't tell you about? perhaps your media had some unusable blocks? what kind of media are you using? the rated capacity is prolly a 'best case.'

and craig's good-eye point about the math happens to make up for the missing 40MB, in your case.

so, ima dunno. test and observe.

georgemp · 03-25-2002, 05:26 AM

well, actually it has got to do with the way the session is written I believe. I'm not sure what the term is (packet cd or direct cd?) but these formats have always given lesser space. To solve it, use Toast in OS X and you will see the full size of the CD. Even in OS 9 if u were to use Apple's Disc burner you would see 40 MB less. hope this helps

georgemp · 03-25-2002, 05:30 AM

well, actually it has got to do with the was the session is written I believe. I'm not sure what the term is (packet cd or direct cd?) but these formats have always given lesser space. To solve it, use Toast in OX X and you will see the full size of the CD. Even in OS 9 if u were to use Apple's Disc burner you would see 40 MB less. hope this helps

loekjehe · 03-25-2002, 05:49 PM

Thanks everybody for your replies! mervTormel: I didn't know this possibility in DiskCopy. But it makes not any difference on my results.

Guys, it seems we might have a real OS X bug here!

I don't have Toast for X so I can only see for OS 9, but I found out the following results only using the Finder (so with or without Toast is not important very much):

System OS 9.2.2
_____________
inserting a 650 MB CD (best quality) says:
656,6 MB capacity for HFS+ / ISO 9660 / MP3 disk
The resulting disk has the following info:
Capacity 655,7 MB
Available disk space: 647,5 MB
Used: 8.1 MB
Toast gives: 656,40 MB
(336075 blocks available).

System OS X
____________
inserting the same 650 MB CD gives:
622,7 MB capacity for HFS+ / ISO 9660 / MP3 disk
The resulting disk has the following info:
Capacity 610 MB
Available disk space: 601,2 MB
Used: 8.7 MB
(In the Terminal with df:
1249280 512-blocks,
18264 blocks used (1 %),
1231016 blocks available.

So it seems that OS X indeed slocks up 46.3 MB available disk space.
I don't have any explanation for this.

Maybe we have a real OS X bug here, everybody please verify the above yourself by inserting the same disk in OS X and OS 9 and make notes of the resulting disk spaces as I did above. If indeed you can also reproduce alike figures, we can file a bug report. Thanks everybody for your help!

Loek

paragon · 10-07-2002, 01:36 PM

Quote:


	Originally posted by mervTormel perhaps i'm wrong about the disk copy utility having anything to do with preparing CD media. ima dunno where i got that idea. using my CD-R media, which is rated at 700MB capacity, if i select Standard (HFS Plus/ISO 6990) in the media prep dialog box, i get offered a 666.8MB CD-R. toast disk info tells me i have 702.8MB available. perhaps there is some overhead pre-calculated by the OSX prepper that toast don't tell you about? perhaps your media had some unusable blocks? what kind of media are you using? the rated capacity is prolly a 'best case.' and craig's good-eye point about the math happens to make up for the missing 40MB, in your case. so, ima dunno. test and observe.

I have the same problem and I noticed that you have replyed to the first message byt saying that a 700 mb is being redused to 666.8 mb

it is the same as 650 mb is redused to 620 mb in the original message, so I was wondering if you have a sulution to this problom.

are there any other burning programs I can use that do not do this?
will burning in os 9.2 hellp?

thanx

loekjehe · 10-07-2002, 06:53 PM

I have the feeling (not checked) that this problem is over in Jaguar.
I noticed that using Toast everything is fine and I can recommend you that program.

paragon · 10-08-2002, 12:43 PM

what kind of licens does it have? sherware, freeware, do I have to buy it?
I tried to burn through the os 9.2 and at first "sucess" it show that there will be 703.? MB but when I let it prepare the cd and then I try to pot a 700 mb file on to it it will show that the cd has only 698.? MB
I know it is better than 640MB but still I nee to burn a 700MB file.
help

mervTormel · 10-08-2002, 12:53 PM

Quote:


	Originally posted by paragon ...but still I nee to burn a 700MB file...

you can't expect to attain this. the 80min/700MB CD-R rating is a raw, theoretical time/size. and there has to be some overhead for filesystem structures and bad blocks. which is why you see an initial "available" size, then a "prepared" size.

you cannot fit 6 lbs. of manure into a 5 lb. bag. lose some weight.

roxio's toast is a commercial product, about $100.00USD

paragon · 10-08-2002, 01:18 PM

well thanks for the tip but the thing is that it is a 699.3 mb (733,296,640 b) file that I got from a 700 MB CD (cheap one) it was burned by a pc computer.
if you got out 6lb of **** out of 6lb bag than you bound to get it in some how
thanks for the toast, I don't have 100$ so can you rcomend on a free program???

03-23-2002, 07:29 AM	#1
loekjehe Prospect Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 9	why is available CD-R disk space 40 MB less in OS X than in OS 9? If I want to burn a CD in OS X it says me the disk has 610 MB available (after inserting the disk and preparing it for burning). If I want to burn the same CD with Toast in OS 9, I have 654 MB available! I don't understand this difference. Does anybody else also have this problem? What should I do to get more disk space available in OS X on my CD's? I feel it is a waste of CD space to burn in OS X in this way and I feel now obliged to burn booting in OS 9 to be economical with my CD's. Is there something wrong with my computer? Any suggestions?

10-08-2002, 12:43 PM	#11
paragon Major Leaguer Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 471	toast? what kind of licens does it have? sherware, freeware, do I have to buy it? I tried to burn through the os 9.2 and at first "sucess" it show that there will be 703.? MB but when I let it prepare the cd and then I try to pot a 700 mb file on to it it will show that the cd has only 698.? MB I know it is better than 640MB but still I nee to burn a 700MB file. help

10-08-2002, 01:18 PM	#13
paragon Major Leaguer Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 471	re toast 2 well thanks for the tip but the thing is that it is a 699.3 mb (733,296,640 b) file that I got from a 700 MB CD (cheap one) it was burned by a pc computer. if you got out 6lb of **** out of 6lb bag than you bound to get it in some how thanks for the toast, I don't have 100$ so can you rcomend on a free program???

03-23-2002, 01:45 PM	#2
Auricchio Prospect Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Cambria, CA Posts: 21	Are you using Toast in both cases? I wouldn't be surprised if a Finder burn and a Toast burn were different.

03-23-2002, 02:11 PM	#3
mervTormel League Commissioner Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 5,536	i believe the disk copy utility has a preference setting for creating/preparing CD media. of the options, there is 610 and 660 MB for CD media. try setting the disk copy preference, /creating\ tab, volume size: ( 660 MB ) and see if that preps a CD with the larger size for you.

03-23-2002, 05:02 PM	#4
Craig R. Arko Site Admin Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 3,988	Possibly OS 9 is measuring in increments of K=1000 (e.g. 1MB = 1000KB) and OS X is measuring (correctly) in increments of 1024 (MB = 1024 KB)?

03-23-2002, 05:49 PM	#5
mervTormel League Commissioner Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 5,536	perhaps i'm wrong about the disk copy utility having anything to do with preparing CD media. ima dunno where i got that idea. using my CD-R media, which is rated at 700MB capacity, if i select Standard (HFS Plus/ISO 6990) in the media prep dialog box, i get offered a 666.8MB CD-R. toast disk info tells me i have 702.8MB available. perhaps there is some overhead pre-calculated by the OSX prepper that toast don't tell you about? perhaps your media had some unusable blocks? what kind of media are you using? the rated capacity is prolly a 'best case.' and craig's good-eye point about the math happens to make up for the missing 40MB, in your case. so, ima dunno. test and observe.

03-25-2002, 05:26 AM	#6
georgemp Prospect Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Chennai. India Posts: 7	well, actually it has got to do with the way the session is written I believe. I'm not sure what the term is (packet cd or direct cd?) but these formats have always given lesser space. To solve it, use Toast in OS X and you will see the full size of the CD. Even in OS 9 if u were to use Apple's Disc burner you would see 40 MB less. hope this helps

03-25-2002, 05:30 AM	#7
georgemp Prospect Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Chennai. India Posts: 7	well, actually it has got to do with the was the session is written I believe. I'm not sure what the term is (packet cd or direct cd?) but these formats have always given lesser space. To solve it, use Toast in OX X and you will see the full size of the CD. Even in OS 9 if u were to use Apple's Disc burner you would see 40 MB less. hope this helps

03-25-2002, 05:49 PM	#8
loekjehe Prospect Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 9	Thanks everybody for your replies! mervTormel: I didn't know this possibility in DiskCopy. But it makes not any difference on my results. Guys, it seems we might have a real OS X bug here! I don't have Toast for X so I can only see for OS 9, but I found out the following results only using the Finder (so with or without Toast is not important very much): System OS 9.2.2 _____________ inserting a 650 MB CD (best quality) says: 656,6 MB capacity for HFS+ / ISO 9660 / MP3 disk The resulting disk has the following info: Capacity 655,7 MB Available disk space: 647,5 MB Used: 8.1 MB Toast gives: 656,40 MB (336075 blocks available). System OS X ____________ inserting the same 650 MB CD gives: 622,7 MB capacity for HFS+ / ISO 9660 / MP3 disk The resulting disk has the following info: Capacity 610 MB Available disk space: 601,2 MB Used: 8.7 MB (In the Terminal with df: 1249280 512-blocks, 18264 blocks used (1 %), 1231016 blocks available. So it seems that OS X indeed slocks up 46.3 MB available disk space. I don't have any explanation for this. Maybe we have a real OS X bug here, everybody please verify the above yourself by inserting the same disk in OS X and OS 9 and make notes of the resulting disk spaces as I did above. If indeed you can also reproduce alike figures, we can file a bug report. Thanks everybody for your help! Loek

10-07-2002, 06:53 PM	#10
loekjehe Prospect Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 9	I have the feeling (not checked) that this problem is over in Jaguar. I noticed that using Toast everything is fine and I can recommend you that program.