How do YOU share a firewire drive?

michael_aos · 04-13-2003, 08:23 PM

XP Pro can "see" firewire disks, as can OS-X.

If I were to buy a big honking firewire drive, how can I really use it to share files between computers?

It seems to me I'll either have to format it HFS+ or NTFS, and neither O/S is going to play nice with the other.

How does this work?

Mike

tjudd01 · 04-14-2003, 02:02 AM

Short answer? 50%/50% Apple brand format, Windows brand format.

A universal disk format (I.E. CDFS) is the only one.

As a side note... You have OS X, why on earth would you want Windows, much less XP?

babertocci · 04-14-2003, 04:39 AM

If you just want to use it to share files and not boot, you could just get one for your Windows box and mount it as a Samba share on your Mac. Mounting an HFS+ volume on Windows would be pretty kludgy to my knowledge.

tlarkin · 04-14-2003, 11:14 AM

i would format the external drive as fat32 or NTFS. OS X can read and mount FAT and NTFS volumes, but FAT and NTFS will not mount HFS+ so you would still be able to transfer files to both macs and windows units. i tried doing this about 2 weeks ago and i tried to split the drive 1/2 FAT32 1/2 HFS+ (and i could not get it to work like that) so i just did FAT 32 and our G4 running os 10.2.4 mounts the drive and reads all the files off it.

Craig R. Arko · 04-14-2003, 11:35 AM

I don't think OS X can mount an NTFS formatted volume, except one which is shared over a network using some networking file protocol.

If you know a way to directly access NTFS I'd dearly like to hear about it.

tlarkin · 04-14-2003, 01:06 PM

i know fat 32 will mount i have done it. NTFS i think will mount, but you have to use a special utility if i can find what it is i will post

michael_aos · 04-14-2003, 01:16 PM

Just FYI, since I don't have a stand-alone firewire drive right now, I brought up my old G4 iMac in "target" mode.

I formatted the drive NTFS, which worked fine in XP Pro.

I booted the OS-X install CD, and it wouldn't let me do anything to the drive.

I formatted a 32GB partition FAT32 in XP Pro, THEN booted the OS-X install CD. It doesn't even see the partitions.

:-(

It doesn't appear that OS/X and XP Pro use the same partition table, so now I'm REALLY confused how you can use a single drive between the two -- unless once OS-X is up it can see the partitions...? Disk utilitiy off the OS-X install CD sure can't see them.

Mike

tlarkin · 04-14-2003, 01:28 PM

you cannot split a hd between hfs+ and fat or ntfs. but since the mac os will mount pc formatted disks, format the firewire drive in FAT32 and your xp machines and os x machines can both mount the drive. in our tech shop our main download/cdrw machine is running xp i download and burn mac files on it all the time. of course xp cannot read them. i also will copy large amounts of updates, files, etc etc on the fat32 firewire drive and copy them to our macs that way. as far as getting a mac to mount an NTFS partition locally i am not sure of how to do that

michael_aos · 04-14-2003, 01:33 PM

It sucks that FAT32 is limited to 32GB partitions.

:-(

I'm still a little confused -- I understand that OS-X will mount FAT32, but it doesn't seem to see the partition table.

So if I have a 60GB drive, and format it with 2x30GB FAT32, how can OS/X "see" it without being able to "see" the partition table?

Maybe it's just the Disk Utility on the OS-X install CD that can't "see" the partition table?

I formatted it 32GB FAT32, and left the rest of the drive unformatted / unallocated, but the OS-X install CD "Disk Utility" just sees it as one big "untitled" partition.

Mike

tlarkin · 04-14-2003, 01:49 PM

yeah i ran into that also. i had a 60 gig that i tried to partition 30g FAT32 and 30g HFS+. disk utility will not see the drive as that partition but will see it as one un formatted volume. but if you plug in your firewire drive that is FAT32 os x will mount it and you can read/write files to it. If there is a way to split a drive 1/2 fat32 and 1/2 HFS+ i would love to know, but from what i have tried and researched it seems impossible

michael_aos · 04-14-2003, 02:08 PM

Honestly, I was hoping I could split it into 2 FAT32 partitions and install OS-X on a FAT32 partition!

That would get me around the 1/2 and 1/2 issue.

But no joy. The disk utility on the OS-X install disk won't see the FAT32 partitions.

Oh well.

Mike

wisof · 04-05-2005, 06:24 PM

I just purchased and configured a LaCie d2 250GB external drive. OS X will mount NTFS but only in read-only mode. So therefore, if you want to use the drive with both operating systems, format the partition in FAT32. There is a misconception that one cannot format FAT32 larger than 32 GB. This simply is not true. WINDOWS will not let you format a FAT32 partition larger than 32GB. I formatted my drive on my 15" PB G4 running OS 10.3.8. I hooked up the drive, started up Disk Utility, and found my drive. Then I went to the "erase" tab and I selected MS-DOS as the file system. If you want to partition, do it at this time. After all of that, I had a 233GB FAT32 partition that works great on both Windows XP/2000 and OS X 10.3.8.

Hope this helps!

cudaboy_71 · 04-05-2005, 11:26 PM

BUT.

always a but.

there IS a 2gb filesize limit in FAT32. this is an easy ceiling to hit if you plan on storing drive images, video or large graphic files.

still, it is the best option it seems at this point.

tlarkin · 04-06-2005, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wisof


	I just purchased and configured a LaCie d2 250GB external drive. OS X will mount NTFS but only in read-only mode. So therefore, if you want to use the drive with both operating systems, format the partition in FAT32. There is a misconception that one cannot format FAT32 larger than 32 GB. This simply is not true. WINDOWS will not let you format a FAT32 partition larger than 32GB. I formatted my drive on my 15" PB G4 running OS 10.3.8. I hooked up the drive, started up Disk Utility, and found my drive. Then I went to the "erase" tab and I selected MS-DOS as the file system. If you want to partition, do it at this time. After all of that, I had a 233GB FAT32 partition that works great on both Windows XP/2000 and OS X 10.3.8. Hope this helps!

The 32GB limit you speak of, is actually a hardware limitation and older IDE controllers. It no longer exists on newer systems and the newer OSes obviously support up to terrabytes of storage space.

dappy · 04-06-2005, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cudaboy_71


	BUT. always a but. there IS a 2gb filesize limit in FAT32. this is an easy ceiling to hit if you plan on storing drive images, video or large graphic files. still, it is the best option it seems at this point.

I have never ran into a 2gb filesize limit on my FAT32 LaCie 250g Porche drive. I have copied 10gb raw DV files to it with no problems. The only problem I run into is the "Item Icon cannot be copied" which is something with special characters that don't translate to the FAT32 file system.

cudaboy_71 · 04-06-2005, 10:56 AM

right. it's 4GB in XP. sorry for the confusion.

tlarkin · 04-06-2005, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dappy


	I have never ran into a 2gb filesize limit on my FAT32 LaCie 250g Porche drive. I have copied 10gb raw DV files to it with no problems. The only problem I run into is the "Item Icon cannot be copied" which is something with special characters that don't translate to the FAT32 file system.

That is also an outdated thing that was mentioned. Back when windows 95 first came out things ran on a FAT16 filesystem which was limited to a partition no bigger than 2 gigs. Which is why if you work on an old PC there will be a 8 gig HD in there with 4 x 2gig partitions.

Here goes a link explaining the differences between FAT16, FAT32, and NTFS.

http://www.pcnineoneone.com/howto/filesystems1.html

cudaboy_71 · 04-06-2005, 11:25 AM

that quote speaks to filesize, not partition size.

FYI, i noticed on my earlier link that XP still cant format larger than 32GB during the install process, 'modernness' notwithstanding.

tlarkin · 04-06-2005, 11:35 AM

Hmm

I don't know where you get your info from but I have a 150gig HD I installed xp pro (release version) on my system at home. It recognized the full size of the drive during the install.

Also, I was simply pointing out someone who posted the 2gig file size limit probably got confused with FAT16's 2gig file system limit from back in the day, since it was not a file size limit but a file system limit. There is a difference.

Anyways, we can just agree to disagree instead of taking it further

*EDIT*

Oh I see you were talking about FAT32 during the installation process, but then again who would want to run windows on a FAT32 filesystem? Just like who would want to run OS X on a non HFS+ files system (which you can no longer do, has to be HFS+ journaled, or UFS)?

Las_Vegas · 04-06-2005, 03:16 PM

The 32GB limit is in MS's FDISK utility. Using the utilities supplied by the HD manufactures bypasses that limit.

04-13-2003, 08:23 PM	#1
michael_aos Prospect Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 44	How do YOU share a firewire drive? XP Pro can "see" firewire disks, as can OS-X. If I were to buy a big honking firewire drive, how can I really use it to share files between computers? It seems to me I'll either have to format it HFS+ or NTFS, and neither O/S is going to play nice with the other. How does this work? Mike

04-06-2005, 11:35 AM	#19
tlarkin League Commissioner Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 11,352	Hmm I don't know where you get your info from but I have a 150gig HD I installed xp pro (release version) on my system at home. It recognized the full size of the drive during the install. Also, I was simply pointing out someone who posted the 2gig file size limit probably got confused with FAT16's 2gig file system limit from back in the day, since it was not a file size limit but a file system limit. There is a difference. Anyways, we can just agree to disagree instead of taking it further EDIT Oh I see you were talking about FAT32 during the installation process, but then again who would want to run windows on a FAT32 filesystem? Just like who would want to run OS X on a non HFS+ files system (which you can no longer do, has to be HFS+ journaled, or UFS)? __________________ sudo make me a sammich Last edited by tlarkin; 04-06-2005 at 11:38 AM.

04-06-2005, 03:16 PM	#20
Las_Vegas League Commissioner Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 5,875	The 32GB limit is in MS's FDISK utility. Using the utilities supplied by the HD manufactures bypasses that limit. __________________ Las_Vegas -- Ts'i mahnu uterna ot twan ot geifur hingts uto. -- Sometimes I wonder… Why is that Frisbee getting Larger? …and then it hits me. -- Disposable thumbs make me specialer than most animals…

04-14-2003, 02:02 AM	#2
tjudd01 Prospect Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 36	Short answer? 50%/50% Apple brand format, Windows brand format. A universal disk format (I.E. CDFS) is the only one. As a side note... You have OS X, why on earth would you want Windows, much less XP?

04-14-2003, 04:39 AM	#3
babertocci Triple-A Player Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 88	If you just want to use it to share files and not boot, you could just get one for your Windows box and mount it as a Samba share on your Mac. Mounting an HFS+ volume on Windows would be pretty kludgy to my knowledge.

04-14-2003, 11:14 AM	#4
tlarkin League Commissioner Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 11,352	i would format the external drive as fat32 or NTFS. OS X can read and mount FAT and NTFS volumes, but FAT and NTFS will not mount HFS+ so you would still be able to transfer files to both macs and windows units. i tried doing this about 2 weeks ago and i tried to split the drive 1/2 FAT32 1/2 HFS+ (and i could not get it to work like that) so i just did FAT 32 and our G4 running os 10.2.4 mounts the drive and reads all the files off it.

04-14-2003, 11:35 AM	#5
Craig R. Arko Site Admin Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Minneapolis, MN Posts: 3,988	I don't think OS X can mount an NTFS formatted volume, except one which is shared over a network using some networking file protocol. If you know a way to directly access NTFS I'd dearly like to hear about it.

04-14-2003, 01:06 PM	#6
tlarkin League Commissioner Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 11,352	i know fat 32 will mount i have done it. NTFS i think will mount, but you have to use a special utility if i can find what it is i will post

04-14-2003, 01:16 PM	#7
michael_aos Prospect Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 44	Just FYI, since I don't have a stand-alone firewire drive right now, I brought up my old G4 iMac in "target" mode. I formatted the drive NTFS, which worked fine in XP Pro. I booted the OS-X install CD, and it wouldn't let me do anything to the drive. I formatted a 32GB partition FAT32 in XP Pro, THEN booted the OS-X install CD. It doesn't even see the partitions. :-( It doesn't appear that OS/X and XP Pro use the same partition table, so now I'm REALLY confused how you can use a single drive between the two -- unless once OS-X is up it can see the partitions...? Disk utilitiy off the OS-X install CD sure can't see them. Mike

04-14-2003, 01:28 PM	#8
tlarkin League Commissioner Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 11,352	you cannot split a hd between hfs+ and fat or ntfs. but since the mac os will mount pc formatted disks, format the firewire drive in FAT32 and your xp machines and os x machines can both mount the drive. in our tech shop our main download/cdrw machine is running xp i download and burn mac files on it all the time. of course xp cannot read them. i also will copy large amounts of updates, files, etc etc on the fat32 firewire drive and copy them to our macs that way. as far as getting a mac to mount an NTFS partition locally i am not sure of how to do that

04-14-2003, 01:33 PM	#9
michael_aos Prospect Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 44	It sucks that FAT32 is limited to 32GB partitions. :-( I'm still a little confused -- I understand that OS-X will mount FAT32, but it doesn't seem to see the partition table. So if I have a 60GB drive, and format it with 2x30GB FAT32, how can OS/X "see" it without being able to "see" the partition table? Maybe it's just the Disk Utility on the OS-X install CD that can't "see" the partition table? I formatted it 32GB FAT32, and left the rest of the drive unformatted / unallocated, but the OS-X install CD "Disk Utility" just sees it as one big "untitled" partition. Mike

04-14-2003, 01:49 PM	#10
tlarkin League Commissioner Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 11,352	yeah i ran into that also. i had a 60 gig that i tried to partition 30g FAT32 and 30g HFS+. disk utility will not see the drive as that partition but will see it as one un formatted volume. but if you plug in your firewire drive that is FAT32 os x will mount it and you can read/write files to it. If there is a way to split a drive 1/2 fat32 and 1/2 HFS+ i would love to know, but from what i have tried and researched it seems impossible

04-14-2003, 02:08 PM	#11
michael_aos Prospect Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Colorado Springs, CO Posts: 44	Honestly, I was hoping I could split it into 2 FAT32 partitions and install OS-X on a FAT32 partition! That would get me around the 1/2 and 1/2 issue. But no joy. The disk utility on the OS-X install disk won't see the FAT32 partitions. Oh well. Mike

04-05-2005, 06:24 PM	#12
wisof Registered User Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 1	I just purchased and configured a LaCie d2 250GB external drive. OS X will mount NTFS but only in read-only mode. So therefore, if you want to use the drive with both operating systems, format the partition in FAT32. There is a misconception that one cannot format FAT32 larger than 32 GB. This simply is not true. WINDOWS will not let you format a FAT32 partition larger than 32GB. I formatted my drive on my 15" PB G4 running OS 10.3.8. I hooked up the drive, started up Disk Utility, and found my drive. Then I went to the "erase" tab and I selected MS-DOS as the file system. If you want to partition, do it at this time. After all of that, I had a 233GB FAT32 partition that works great on both Windows XP/2000 and OS X 10.3.8. Hope this helps!

04-05-2005, 11:26 PM	#13
cudaboy_71 All Star Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: sacramento, ca Posts: 874	BUT. always a but. there IS a 2gb filesize limit in FAT32. this is an easy ceiling to hit if you plan on storing drive images, video or large graphic files. still, it is the best option it seems at this point.

04-06-2005, 10:56 AM	#16
cudaboy_71 All Star Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: sacramento, ca Posts: 874	right. it's 4GB in XP. sorry for the confusion.

04-06-2005, 11:25 AM	#18
cudaboy_71 All Star Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: sacramento, ca Posts: 874	that quote speaks to filesize, not partition size. FYI, i noticed on my earlier link that XP still cant format larger than 32GB during the install process, 'modernness' notwithstanding.