A Fair Election -- possible?
 

With only a few days remaining before those who haven't cast their ballots early go to the polls, I'm afraid that the upcoming election will be fraught with dirty tricks, voters taken off the rolls, ballots that aren't at all clear (with the intent of having folks who might vote the wrong way not vote at all), and hacked voting machines. I hope that isn't so.

What's your take, American readers? Please note that I am not discussing who will win or cheat; I'm talking about the process which to me seems entirely too fragile. Am I way off base?

I feel that the voting system is the United States is broken. It's been reworked too much, like Joan Rivers' face.

IMHO the Presidency should be decided by popular vote. Voting should be held on Saturday. And a viable 3rd party would receive equal funding from the government...instead of the current 2-party system.

Also, companies like Diebold and ES&S would be actually accountable for creating systems practically asking to be hacked. Internet based voting would be cool but I'm not sure how secure that'd be. After all...every 1 and 0 would pass over/through AT&T, Comcast, & Friends. And what about people with about access?

But isn't it a shame that in a country that can run fairly bomb-proof ATM networks, they can't come up with a secure way of voting that yields results in a day or so?

Exactly, I've never accidentally received $4000 instead of $40.00. It's very discouraging.

Voter suppression is fraud, and one side is notorious for using this tactic. The other side has more voters, so no need to use it.

I believe the saying is, "where your heart is, there will your treasure also be."

The problem with voting systems is that you are asking a bueracracy to do something quickly, effectively and without adding loopholes so they can cheat. I have about as much confidence as I can in a system that was created under those circumstances.

I'm guessing it won't matter... this is looking like a landslide. In any case, if we foul it up the Supreme Court can always tell us how we meant to vote.

There's got to be a better way. Last year, our county clerk reported a 40 percent error rate in her database of registered voters. All fixed now. Yeah, right.

Authorities foiled an assassination attempt on Obama yesterday. Not sure we have a rule to cover the assassination of a President Elect. But, again, I suspect the Supreme Court might have some ideas.

I'm thinking there's got to be a reason that so many are trying to make this look like it's going to be close, and I don't think it's to be fair to the underdog.

I've gotten very cynical over the last eight years. :(

I've posted this before, CWT, but it fits your mood:

LOL! I know exactly how she feels.

I think this election is a referendum on "Joe the plumber's" intelligence. I hope they pass this time, but I'm afraid that if they do, their votes may not be counted.

Well I did the early voting thing today.... turns out early voting at the Senior Citizen Center means 10am. (Early voting is authorized from 7am to 10pm). Maybe a two hour wait.

Big improvements on the machines over the last time I voted. Easy to read touch screen, easy and obvious navigation, 3 chances to verify what you've entered and, most important of all to me, there was a printed tape that updated every time you hit a button. There is a hard record should voter fraud be alleged.

They did require a picture ID (driver's license or state issued ID) and verified each person against the voter rolls and checked each person off on a print out.... if they wanted to, they could verify nobody voted twice but since they did that all by hand there is no easy or fast way to cross check names.

Only surprise was there were six choices for President.... never heard of three of them. Apparently it just isn't that difficult to get on the ballot in my state.

Sure, I know there is no system that can entirely prevent tampering, but if my state is any indication this is all going to go a lot smoother than I initially thought.

ah, that's politics... technological improvements would be easy, but technological improvements would lower the ability of politicians to influence voter behavior. for instance, simplified voting would probably mean an increase in voter participation among young and lower class voters, which would change voting demographics, and it would limit the usefulness of certain canvassing techniques designed to discourage voting. those kinds of things translate into a political power, and if there's one thing a political party never gives up without a fight, it's power. I mean, last census the census bureau wanted to take the entirely sensible step of using statistical estimation to measure hard-to-reach populations (the homeless, illegal and semi-legal immigrants, etc.). the republican party shot it down, requiring a literal head count, because statistical estimation was likely to give a more accurate reading of those populations, which would affect everything from local districting to federal funding. Politics runs on functional lies; technology is too honest.

Come on, these elections are the fairest of all. We are not in Zimbabwe were the results were never shared with the public.

I do agree that voting should be done online if it can be secure. It's probably just as secure as hanging chads.

ah, well... democracy is one of those things (like air) that you can't really have too much of. this may not be like Zimbabwe (which I suspect is like having a pillow stuffed over your face), but it's still annoying when you feel the limits of it.

It's even more annoying when you think it's just an illusion. The 2000 "election" still has me thinking that it is.

Life is an illusion, my son. just a question of whether it's a good trip or a bad one. ;)

I just knew that at some point "American Election" and "Acid Trip" were going to collide. I was just waiting for it...

lol - actually, they collided about 8 years ago. we're just now getting to the 'pay-the piper' stage... :o

Are you intoning that our current problems can be explained in terms of drug addiction and rehab?

If the shoe fits the the President...

Voter fraud is common. Spoke with two people yesterday who have both moved into a new precinct since the last election. But, they intentionally did not change their address on the voter registration rolls.... their kids still go to school in the old district and they want to vote on that ballot for a school board position.

I explained that was voter fraud (can't vote for other people's representatives), but they just really could care less. Both voted on the wrong ballot with no problem.

With early voting, you can vote anywhere (not limited to voting at your designated polling place) and they'll give you the correct ballot based on the address in the voter registration database.

Presumably, if one moved out of the county they could vote in both counties if they wanted to... nobody would ever know the difference since there are separate voter registration rolls.

That's a minor issue compared to voter suppression. Voting in your 'old' neighborhood isn't an organized effort to affect an entire election.

By the way, if their kids till go to school their, there is a good chance that they can still legally vote there, as long as they don't vote elsewhere. They're probably still considered legal residents in the old neighborhood.

Ha! You underestimate the importance of a school board election in Little Rock, Arkansas. Presidential election is small potatoes.

Point taken.... not sure what the residential requirements are on a move across the street. I'd point out that the school kids attend bears little relationship to where they live. Unfortunate, but that is a fact.

Slightly offtopic, but speaking of voting, the national mock student election just ended. There were 2 options to vote, computer or paper ballot. Our school used the old paper ballot for some reason, so we had to count up all the votes. A couple other students and I counted up the votes for the mock election for our school. The national results for all 50 states can be found here:
http://www.nationalmockelection.org/

Interestingly, Obama won by a huge amount, Obama/Biden 62.1% vs. McCain/Palin 34.23%, Nader/Gonzalez 1.3% (:)).

Of course, this does not represent what the actual election will be like, but there's been many studies suggesting that children will vote for the same people their parents vote for.

That would be funny if we hadn't had the last eight years.

Yep. Just like religion is passed parent to child, so is political leaning. In general.

They must be talking about the election at school, because my 8 yr old is even talking about Obama and McCain, and funny enough started calling McCain a "mean old dummy" :rofl:
I hadn't talked to her about either of them. Although she knows my opinion of Bush. Probably because I curse and spit every time I speak his name.

All politics are local.

Besides, the Arkansas election result for President has been predetermined. McCain wins hands down. Can't explain why without getting into taboo subjects for discussion on this forum. But, it is a done deal.

The little one's school had an election, too. Nearly unanimous for McCain. Course, that was after they had been indoctrinated (brain washed) on the correct way to vote... private school, they can do that. Little one was "enlightened" at home after the vote and hopefully has been freed from the Vulcan mind meld.

I have to say, although I don't like Bush either, I feel kinda sorry for him. Everything that happened after 9/11 isn't all his fault, you know. There's also everyone else in the Executive branch, and in Congress and even some people in the Supreme Court to blame, too.

Bush takes most of the punishment mainly because he's the President, the person everyone here in the US thinks of whenever someone says "government".

Who was it that filled the Justice Department with incompetent boobs, FEMA with political cronies, and made economic decisions based on how they would affect his friends in Big Oil? Who was it that outed a CIA agent? And no, that would not be done by anyone under him without his knowledge and consent, because who was it that demanded loyalty above competency?

Sorry? I feel sorry for the country.

well, I'm no Bush fan either, but I have to say that I feel sympathy for him. GWB's main problem as president is that he tended to think in terms of statements and moments rather than consequences. I kinda suspect that he kept thinking 'this is where I climb up on my horse, wave my white hat, and ride off into the sunset of history' like it was some old Ronald Reagan flick. except every time he turned to ride off, whatever it was came and bit him on the arse. I never read presidential memoirs, but I might make an exception for his because I can't imagine what he's feeling right now. and worse, to know that your own people want to hide you away so you don't queer their election chances, like some secret family shame. I may think that what's happening to him is perfect and inevitable karma, but still...

I feel as much sympathy for him as I did when I saw the trap door fall under Saddam's feet. Both had it coming, and Bush deserves more than he's gotten.


Oh! And did you hear about the latest round of deregulation he's sneaking in at the last minute? He's unrepentant, and deserves no pity.