Apple gaming rig!
 

Wow, the new Mac Pro supports the 8800GT...8 cores...all that RAM. Yeah, this could be a good gaming machine.

http://www.appleinsider.com/articles...at_3_2ghz.html

And the one I would want is only 20,000! :). It involves 32gb of RAM and two 300gb HD's running at 15,000rpm, so.... Two Apple 30" displays, the 8800GT (which seems to only come in the dual link DVI version), Apple Care (just incase my mad games blow the computers mind), Wirless mouse and keyboard. Yeah, that would be aw3some!

:o wow now my dream mac is even more expensive, but wouldnt you rather have the new quadro, even though its not a gaming card, it would probably be better than the 8800, and 1.5gb!!... wow imagine that with crysis.... :D

I thought we had this discussion already ;). The Quadro is not a gaming card and therefore does not have the correct functions to make a game run quickly. The Quadro is a workstation card, designed for 3D graphics between multiple screens, etc. The 8800 will kick the Quadro's butt at any gaming competition because of this. So yes, I would prefer the 8800GT.

I want my 16 core! ;) I keed, I keed.

Really, I would be satisfied with the quad core if they would cut the number of drives and PCI slots and put it all in a half-height enclosure.

I know i know, but it would still be good, anyways how come they only put in the 8800 gt, and not the the gtx?

I'd say cost, but I somehow doubt that was some sort of object for Apple. The GT is newer (if less powerful), and is supposed to pack 95% the wallop that the GTX does, and it uses less power while doing it.

So, my guess would be that this was just a nod to the gamers out there, and that the picked the one that would have the least power consumption. But I don't really know.

its a start for the gamer market, but the mac pro is still overkill for the average gamer, especially considering the price... a start none the less

Not worth it, could build a $1,000 PC that would blow it out of the water in gaming performance.

$1000, that sounds in my price range, care to elaborate??

Here is a start the rest you can pick up as you go or find bundled deals. OEM copies of windows are cheap too if you don't already own a license.

https://secure.newegg.com/NewVersion...ryWishList.asp

For the record, I highly doubt you could build a PC for a 1000 dollars that would blow it away. Though I can't prove it...

But the last I checked prices are relatively similar between PC parts and Mac parts. Well, unless you like cheap knock offs I suppose.

At any rate, yeah, it still cheaper to go PC for games, but if you are going to have a Mac anyway...

Xeons give no advantage in gaming at all, where as the C2D do. That is because developers write their games to take advantage of the multi media instruction sets built into those processors.

Until Apple makes a basic mid range tower with the ability to slap whatever video card you want in it, it will not come close to competing with gaming on the PC level.

Ah good point. So, they may have the video card, or at least one of them, for now. But we're still waiting on a tower with the C2D. Perhaps the new iMacs? Or even the new MBP?

I still think this is a step in the right direction, at least we know that the 8800 now works with the Mac. I just hope Apple sees fit to keep up with the trends from now on.

well the processor I linked was a quad core 2 duo, and that 8800 I linked also is pretty much a GTS, but a lot cheaper. Benchmark wise it only barely beats the GT, so for the money its more worth it. However, Nvidia 9 series cards are due out first quarter this year, or so I think I read somewhere. So, then Apple will be a step behind again.

Oh goody, and with how long it took Apple to catch on with the 8800...who knows when a 9 series will be out? I need to write Steve Jobs again... ;).

Well, if I'm not going to buy a monitor, 1000$ is enough to buy a monster machine for gaming. Maybe something about 1100-1200$ to make it perfect... And I'm not including the price of Vista:)

[edit]: on conditions that you buy the parts separately and assemble your machine yourself

Interesting post on BF.

GAMING PERFORMANCE?
Anandtech tested both using various 3D games that push the GPU to the limit.

If you look at the Unreal Tournament 3 results at 1920x1200:
Radeon HD 2600 XT = 32 fps
GeForce 8800 GT = 80 fps

Those results are using Vista drivers. We expect a similar gap in performance when we test using Leopard drivers.

That's a pretty big performance gain for a price difference of only $200 USD.

Yes of course its building it yourself, if you really wanted to save a few bucks find a good Dell coupon and you could easily just add more RAM and a video card to it and call it done. That may even include a monitor.

Gaming is still not viable on a Mac compared to a PC, however that is if you are just building a system for gaming only. I will be building a new PC soon because of starcraft 2 and Fallout 3. Both of those would not run very well on my PC. I have 1 windows machine at home and its soul purpose is gaming and multimedia. The rest are Linux or OS X boxes. I don't ever bother gaming on my Macs.

Good news!
I haven't heard the news about these games! I hope Fallout 3 will be good enough to compete with the second part!
I'm anxious to see Jagged alliance 3. I hope this will be a great game!
BTW, have you seen the Fallout teaser?
http://youtube.com/watch?v=zPt08UYmyMo

It's a chicken or egg conundrum. If you're (that's plural) willing to build a PC to run games, why would a game developer write for anything but Windows?

I would disagree, the gaming market was there before on the PC side of things before windows even came out. I mean the first person shooter was a DOS game, Wolfenstein. Yes, Macs did have games back in the day, but it never caught on to the mac user base. Plus there has always been a smaller mac user base.

Then MS developed Direct 3D, Direct X, and gave game developers APIs to help them develop their software. Apple has not, until recently with Leopard. So, its not even like apple even tried to get that market.

Also, to quote Steve Jobs, he said that gaming is a market they won't get into because he thinks console systems are the wave of the future. Obviously jobs has never tried to shoot anyone with a analog controller versus a mouse and keyboard.

Yeah, I have seen all the trailers, read all the articles since I am a huge fallout fan. However, I am worried that Bethesda will royally screw it up. I thought Oblivion was okay but it lost its luster very fast for me. Where as I can install and play Fallout 1 and 2 today and still have a blast playing it. They also took out targeting the croch, and now its real time queue based game play, like knights of the old republic. Fallout was so awesome because it was its own genre, and you never really say strategy/RPG/Post apocalyptic games. I will still buy it, but if it sucks I will definitely complain about it!

That's what I'm saying. If as a Mac user, you don't demand Mac games, but are instead willing to build/buy a PC to play them, why would Apple or any game developer make an effort to provide Mac games?

That is the whole point. If the Mac users want to play games why not let them? Why not give them more video card support? Why not give developers APIs?

It may actually sway some gamers to switch over to Mac if they were pondering the idea anyway. I don't see apple not benefiting from it.

Here's how they don't benefit:
1. Mac users demonstrate that they're willing to build/buy PCs or consoles to get games.
2. Apple makes an effort to make the Mac more attractive to game developers.
3. Game developers don't bite, because they'd rather develop for one platform, and they figure that Mac users will keep buying PCs or consoles to play the games.
4. Apple has then wasted time & money on pushing Mac games.

OK, I can turn that right around

1) PC gamer is sick of windows, considers buying mac, no game support, no dice, lost a customer - loss of potential money

2) Apple makes half assed very late effort in 2007 after the gaming market has been established. Change won't happen over night

3) Game developers don't like Steve Jobs because he is against computer gaming. He keeps saying consoles are the only future in gaming. When the head of Apple says that, it does not attract game developers.

4) Apple wastes money all the time, and in all honesty creating a set of APIs, how hard is that? Not to mention those set of APIs can be used for so much more than just gaming. Any audio/video application could utilize it, and we all know there are plenty of audio/video applications out there for OS X. These APIs are not limited to gaming.

So why prove Jobs right? If he says consoles are the future and Mac users go out and buy them, how could that encourage game development on the Mac? It seems to me that if we reduce the demand, the suppliers will respond by reducing their efforts.

Trust me Apple is far from narrowing the demand of PC gamers. They are a pretty die hard crowd and they won't be dying down any time soon, in fact it is increasing every year.

The fact is that Jobs has no vision of this, he isn't a gamer and doesn't understand. Apple doesn't seem to be run by committee either. They are more like a dictatorship, at least that is my impression.

You can dress it up any way you like it, but the Mac is not a competitor in the gaming market. Also, consoles will never kill the PC for many reasons. Just look at Crysis, the most advanced video game out to date, it only runs on the PC. The developers, crytek, claim they could eventually port the game over to the current next gen consoles but it wouldn't be as high tech or as cutting edge. Platform issues are also a pain in the butt when dealing with consoles, but they do offer some things which are nice. I own a xbox 360 and a Wii and I like them but prefer certain games on a PC, and I don't see how a console can compete with certain games.

Huh? I'm talking about Mac gamers. I know, you're thinking: "What Mac gamers?" and that's my point. If Jobs says that games aren't needed/wanted on the Mac, and Mac users agree by buying PCs and/or consoles, why would a developer make a Mac game?

I think SJ could definitely do more to attract game developers, but I think Mac users could do more too.

There is the crux of the matter, eh? I couldn't agree more.

In reality, the only way that Gaming will come to the Mac is if Apple makes a move. It's just like launching a new console into a world that already feels it has enough (like the Xbox v. the PS2 and Nintendo GameCube and Sega Dreamcast for example). Apple has to do two things to make it work.

One -- a big exclusive. If Halo 1 had come to Mac first (like it had been intended to...:(,)then we wouldn't be having this problem. Apple has to land a few games that onlycome to Mac. That way people will buy Macs for gaming, regardless of their 'lack of flexibility'.

Two -- Apple has to make game development easier and more interesting. Microsoft kicks Apples but at this, they develop and maintain DirectX line. Apple only has OpenGL and the all new CoreAnimation. OpenGL is not really maintained that well, and CoreAnimation is too new (plus no one really can tell if it's for games or what...) In my opinion it would be best for Apple to develop CoreAnimation into an exciting, easy to use gaming API. That way Apple has an exclusive on the 'coolness' as it were.

If Apple does these two things game sales will go up for Mac, that will broaden the market, and we'll see more developers working on Mac games. The egg will have been hatched, if you will.

Edit: Sorry, for some reason I did not see the second page until after writing this post. I still think it's relevant, so I left it here. Just consider that I did not read the second page before writing it.


And as a quick response to tlarkin-- I think the reason that PC's will always be a viable market is because they are absolutely cutting edge. And game developers like, and need, to push the boundaries in order to develop better games. Since consoles are locked, more or less, PC's will always have to be there to keep things current. Consoles, in reality, depend on this model as well, I think they'd be sad to see the PC market die.

It's all Jobs. He thinks there is no place for gaming on a Mac. The user base has nothing to do with it, and since when has apple really listened to their user base? They are more like the architect and give you a platform that you choose to do, where MS is more like the committee that puts the features you ask for. There was a huge article about this on some tech site I can see later if I can google it. It made some great non biased opinions about how Apple and Microsoft run their businesses.

The point you are discussing now is very interesting.
I must agree with the idea cwtnospam expressed: why should developers think about writing games on Macs, if people meaningly buy PC versions. 95% of the game market is PC-oriented (if not more).
I think it is kinda prejudice - apple computers are more serious, they're initially are not intended for gaming. People who want to get a computer solely for gaming will not be ready to spend a huge amount of $ for a Macbook Pro. Mac is just a more serious companion than PC

I followed your link, and your wish list is empty.

I would like to know exactly what your $1,000 PC gaming system would be comprised of. Please give us the whole breakdown, part-by-part, and we'll assume for this thread that you already have a Mac system that does everything you need to do, except gaming. To help save money on your $1,000 PC, you can even consider networking with the Mac to eliminate purchase cost on the PC side (example: sharing an optical drive, if that's possible).

I'm requesting this information because I would be very interested in building a gaming only PC which supplements my current PowerBook, or possibly a MacBook.

We can even start this in a new thread if it's more suitable.

Thanks!

Perhaps a new thread?
 

.
Now that is a fascinating topic, Zalister!

For the sake of visibility, I think it would be an excellent idea starting a new thread.
You were thinking then of the "shared resources" aspect of this, no?

-- ArcticStones

Sorry, ArcticStones, could you include the original text in a quote balloon? I'm not sure which of Zalister's comments you are remarking about.

oops that was a temp wish list so its now expired.

I was basically this

intel Q6600 C2D processor
Asus Motherboard
PNY 512mb 8800GT
2gigs of RAM

It was right around 750ish with that hardware right there. HD optical drive and more RAM can always be added later, and you can use generic parts. So just buy the cheapest optical drive. Powersupply will cost you around another $100. The rest is really negotiable, and I am also taking into consideration you have a monitor you can use.

Well, right off the bat, I notice that the PNY 8800 GT card is about $90 dollars cheaper than the 8800 GT offered at the Apple Store. Both cards have 512 MB of VRAM.

Interesting development (found at BF):

If you still want to order the GeForce 8800 GT, go to the Apple Store USA and search on "MB137Z/A" to find the kit. The price is $349. If you are very unhappy about it not working on your "old" Mac Pro, then sign our petition asking Apple to create a version that will.

I respond to you by saying you should read my post near the top of this page :).