Internet through cell phone? Treo 650?
 

I may need to temporarily move into a place where there is no possibility of broadband. I could use dialup, but I don't want to start phone service there.

So I did some investigation and discovered that the Treo 650 phone could possibly be used for internet connection on a PowerBook G4 (Alum.). Is this really possible?

If not, can one use that phone for internet connection, then just connect it to the laptop for transferring files? (I am talking about downloading small documents and PDFs on the Treo, and then dragging them to the G4.)

Thanks!:confused:

If you can get dial-up, chances are that you can get DSL.

there are lots of places you can get dialup but not dsl. for dsl, you have to be within a certain distance of the phone company's switch.

i use a treo 650 gsm for a wireless data connection on my laptop all the time. i use the bluetooth connection between phone and powerbook. i have t-mobile as a provider. they have a moderately priced data plan ($20/month unlimited) and decent speed (GSM/Edge).

verizon has higher speed data, but they charge a lot more, too. i don't think the treo 650 can take advantage of the fastest verizon data service -- you may need the treo 700 for that.

Yes, I am very aware about the limitations put on DSL. However, with the advent of ADSL2+, max. distances are becoming larger and larger. UMTS would be your best bet if you live in a rural area, that has cell phone coverage, but where you are not close enough to the CO (central office) to get DSL.

Searh on howardforums.com and you should be able to find the settings that you need for your carrier or the reason why it won't work. Major variables include your carrier, the location and your data plan.

Just try it. Go to Bluetooth setup assistant, pair your Treo, and select the option to use it as an internet connection. If you're on a GSM/GPRS system (T-Mobile, AT&T) then you should get Ross Barkman's generic GPRS scripts and use one of those as the modem driver (you need to have those installed before pairing the phone). If you are on Sprint (CDMA, 1xRTT) then you can just use the built-in Sprint card modem script. The same should work on Verizon since they use the same technology and the same system hardware.

For Sprint and Verizon the dialup number is #777. For GSM systems you leave it all blank.

Verizon specifically blocks access to dialup on most of their phones, so this may not work if that's your carrier.

I am actually in New York City (Brooklyn), but in an industrially-zoned street -- spitting's distance from the Statue of Liberty. Verizon is the carrier and they said no to DSL.

There is a café 2 blocks away with wireless (but only open till 7 pm); I wonder if I could pick up there signal somehow.

I don't actually have the Treo yet. Can you download your e-mail attachments on the Treo and then just network it to the G4 and drag the file over? Does the Treo show up as an icon on the desktop?
(All the sites I found about the Treo only mention its connection to Iphoto, Isync, Address, Itunes, etc. But I know how sometimes, with cell phones and cameras, that could be your only option -- not simply connect-and-drag files like you do with a separate drive.)

The Treo 700 doesn't work with Macs, I've heard.

THanks!

You might be able to hit a 2 block distance with a Cantenna, pretty cheap to try. Do you have line of sight?

The Treo 700 is a Pocket PC. Palm OS is basically dead and even Palm has seen this. So it shares all the Mac to PPC issues we already know about, but it does have a lot of other benefits and features. All of the PPC-phones will work with the Mac for wireless internet access. Synchronizing data can be an issue, but there are ways to resolve that.

Maybe I should try to make a cantenna; I could mount it on the roof and get a direct line-of-sight.

ANy PCI wireless card recommendations? (I only have an airport card).

how about a cable modem? most companies don't require a 1 year contract... they usually go month-to-month

As yubbie2 suggested, cable is another consideration given your location.

Also, several ISP's in NYC have been experimenting with WiMAX as a wireless broadband solution. I would do a little research with that as well. I had the opportiunity to test a commerically available WiMAX system and for LOS at 5 miles, the system operated at 6Mbps. Just a thought. I'd keep looking around a bit before making any decisions. You may be able to get stand-alone DSL through another provider or even stand-alone cable service. I would say that internet access via a mobile phone should be your absolute last option.

I think I'm going to try a cantenna.

justins7, are you in direct LOS(line of sight) of that access point to which you would like to connect? If not, I foresee you having some severe problems connecting to an Access Point that is more than 100ft away. Remember, when you use an antenna, especially one as directional as a cantenna, you will be increasing the noise that your antenna picks up. If someone with a 2.4GHz phone or even another AP is inbetween you and your desired AP, you will be hard-pressed to cut through all that interference and recover a signal thats useful. I would be anxious to know how that turns out. Let us know!

Well, there is a Direct Line of Site to residential buildings in the area. There is also the cafe two blocks away (not sure if these are legal).

It's an odd spot: an industrial block, but around the corner from residential houses in Brooklyn. I can clearly see downtown Manhattan from the fire escape. I am really tempted to just point the cantenna out the fire escape and see what I can pick up, if anything.

Many people are tempted to do do as well, however; such an action is illegal. If someone notices you using their AP without permission/consent, they could prosecute you.

I have the same problem here in my apartment complex. However, for those that REALLY want to get free internet, i've partitioned my bandwidth on a 802.11b/g router that only utilizes channel 1 and is trained about about 60Kbps. I'd be careful about where/how you get your internet connectivity.

The legality of this is yet unproven and untested.

Be discrete, don't abuse, and encrypt everything. Remember that IM and mail are normally plaintext and easily intercepted.

There hasn't been a court case yet, but last year a man was arrested in Florida for unauthorized access to a computer network, a felony.

'Anyone know what happened to him?

Don't you think that it's only a matter of time before WiFi access is universal and free? It would happen sooner if the phone companies didn't have such a stranglehold on telecommunications. (I realize that they spent the money on infrastructure, etc.)
These are radiowaves, right? New York CIty is swamped in WIFi and many people are happy to split the cost and share service if they could.

It seems like a ridiculous system...

I've attended several conferences where spectrum policy, along with Wireless Privacy policies were discussed. All present panelists were in agreement that wardriving/hijacking/etc are all prosecutable. The last thing I would do is encourage this type of activity on these forums.

Google is in the late stages of trying to implement a free WiFi network in their hometown. However, their engineers did not do their research properly and now they've had to rethink their network because of the sheer amount of APs that are needed to cover the area. This is what happens when people don't think before they do something, especially when it comes to RF spectrum management. When WiMAX becomes widely available, you'll see WiFi integrated into those networks, for a fee of course. The end all solution will be a FTTH with wireless throughout your home at rates >100Mbps.

For a large city like NYC, mobile WiMAX (802.16e) will be the best solution when it becomes available next year.

We are really thinking of ultimately trying to set up a Line of Site sharing between subscribers of DSL (friends), for those who are off the grid (a few blocks away).

This is probably illegal too, but it is really unfair that those working in these areas have few other options.

Why not UMTS or EV-DO as your broadband solution? If you can get a cell-signal, you can get these; be it a decent cell-signal.

That's what he was asking about in his original post, though actually his Treo will only do 1xRTT. Same coverage.

I'm aware of the Treo's limitations, however; you can get dedicated EV-DO or UMTS cards for your labtop/desktop and receive roughly 500Kbps down/up. For example, Verizon's offerings would be worth a look.

I am sorry but I have no idea what UMTS or EV-DO is. Please enlighten me.

By the way, cable is cost-prohibitive -- aren't you required to have basic cable (plus considering that it's an industrial location, maybe it's a higher rate.) too? And last time I checked satellite had no offerings for Mac users.

No. Like DSL, you can get stand-alone cable internet service which requires no other cable-like services. I am currently receiving stand-alone DSL because I did not want to pay for a land-line (POTS). As for Satellite data connections, STAY AS FAR AWAY FROM THEM AS POSSIBLE, unless you have absolutely no other choice. Most satellite internet providers strip down TCP and use UDP as the session protocol, which means there is no guarenteed transmission/reception of packets. And thats before you even consider the physical distance to overcome (large delays).

EV-DO: Evolution Data Optimized, or 1xEV-DO is nothing more than a wireless broadband standard. Supports rates up to 3.1Mbps down, depending on the signal. It was originally designed to give mobile cell phones data capabilities.

UMTS: Universal Mobile Telecommunications System, is basically the same as EV-DO, but uses different frequendy bands and supports rates up to 2Mbps down.

In most places you are not required to have basic TV to get internet.

Satellite DOES work with the Mac, no issue there, but it's unlikely that you'll get a shot to the sky in NYC. It's also high-latency and expensive.

Bored28 is talking about a PCMCIA card that puts you on the cell network. Same as using your Treo, but the cards also do 1xEV-DO which is faster. I don't know where he came up with 500k, I consistently get 750-810k with Verizon cards and 790-830k with Sprint. Speed may vary by signal strength. This is also quite expensive; $60/mo if you have voice with the same carrier and $80 if you do not. Also they all require a one year contract.

Cable and DSL are your best choices.

As I stated, these are the maximum rates. Given a software program I have, RadioMobile, In NYC, the average rates are b/w 400Kbps and 2.4Mbps due to path-loss, Raleigh Fading, multipath-doppler delay, etc. I used 500Kbps as a minimum because there is no point in telling someone something that they may not be able to get.

Too often, people are told "the best" possible outcome, when in fact, they'll never see that outcome unless conditions are absolutely perfect or, in this instance, you live inside a Faraday cage. No disrespect, but I've see it all too often people being fed "heres what you should get" or "well i get this, so i dont know why you can't get it." I'm just trying to keep expectations low to ensure that this person does not go into this situation with hopes that are suddenly dashed.

EVDO PCMCIA card
 

Well, I can't get cable (the building has never been wired), so I am considering a Verizon EVDO PCMCIA card. How do the speeds compare to DSL?

(I realize you guys posted the actual speeds, but I guess I don't really know how those numbers compare to DSL.)

DSL service is dependant on the distance you are from the CO(central office) The closer you are, the higher the rate. I am 3.85 Miles from my CO and I am currently receiving 3.0Mbps down/640kbps up, however; that is the ISP's premium service for my area.

The basic plan that most ISP's offer is 1.5Mbps down/640Kbps up. EV-DO is capable of 3.0Mbps down/~up. However, that is dependant of the signal you receive. Data transmitted via EVDO is different than voice service sent via the same frequency band. I would imagine that you would get anywhere between 500Kbps-2Mbps down/256Kbps-540Kbps up where you are. You really will not know until you try it.

I would imagine you would get 500Kbps-750Kbps down/~256Kbps up according to my Radio Mobile program. But thats just an estimate.

Well, it sounds like EVDO is at least 9-10 times as fast as dialup, so maybe that's the way to go. At $60/month it's no bargain, but it could be my only real choice.

I am not using the connection for games or anything, just work, e-mail, etc.

Thanks!

Its a relatively new technology, that is: using EVDO as a dedicated broadband technology for your home computer(s). Its been around for quite a while, however; only recently has it been implemented to be used as the primary broadband connection to your home. After a while, the price will come down, or at least until you start to get more competition in your local market. Good luck!

Keep in mind that this use will be against the Terms of Service for Verizon, and possibly for Sprint (I have not checked that, but definitely Verizon). I don't know the likelihood of enforcement, it probably depends on total usage.

What use will be against the terms of service for Verizon?

Use as a fixed location or landline-replacement internet connection is against the TOS.

"Use as a fixed location or landline-replacement internet connection is against the TOS."

Maybe if I just walk around the room while using the card I will be within the Terms of Service.

I think you are reading into the fine print a bit too literally. The same could be said if I used my cell phone's GPRS functions while standing still. Simply ridiculous. At no time will Verizon risk losing a customer based because of a fixed access service. Not only is that a poor business model, but it will alienate its loyal customers who want to use Verizon as a complete service provider. And even then, the whole idea is that this card can go into a laptop, which is inherently portable.

Go to howardforums.com and do a search, then ask all the people who have been reporting service cancellations if they are lying.

Better yet, I'll just call Verizon and ask them about it. Its always better to get information from the horses mouth rather than from a 3rd party entity. And I don't think anyone is "lying." This isn't second grade, unless of course you passed a note in studyhall saying that Verizon's policies are overbearing. I was simply looking at it from a business and economical perspective, whereas such a policy would make little sense in the overall scheme of a telecommunications company's business model.

Yes, however the customer service reps are generally clueless. The whole issue of using phones as a modem or using the cards for various purposes, as well as the amount of data included in the "unlimited" plans (they are NOT unlimited) is an ongoing controversy. In three calls I got three different answers on how much "unlimited" is, and it's not defined anywhere.

The business model is that you want to advertise "unlimited" usage to get people in the door, then knock off your top 5% heavy users. That's how you make the bigger profits, not keeping your heavier users. People HAVE been cancelled for excessive use and for "landline replacement" usage. Also at that point they bill you for termination since you broke the TOS.

When calling a Telecommunications Company, I never talk to a customer service rep for anything other than getting them to direct my call. In the short time that i've been consulting, there is one thing that i've learned. Most reps and manager for that matter, when faced with factual evidence and emperical data will concede to your point of view and thus; become much more malleable.

You just really need to use logic when talking to telecom companies because for the most part, the really have no idea about what the heck they are talking about. Its sad too because if only telecom companies would understand that the customers would make their lives alot better if they would only cater to them a bit more. There is a reason why the telecom companies listed a customer satisfaction last year of roughly 30%. You'd think they could take hint.

But I don't see what's wrong with paying Verizon for a service option they provide. They can't give me DSL, and cable and satellite are not viable options. EVDO is a service they provide that can perhaps fill in this void. I would be paying them twice the cost of DSL -- aren't they just interested in getting more customers and more coverage? I don't see what difference it makes to them whether or not I am standing still or moving around makes.

:eek: (What does the service contract say, anyway? That you have to move at least 300 feet per hour?)

Its just another example of Telcom companies alienating and subduing their customers. I simply don't understand why they refuse to see that if they cater to their customers, good things will happen. 30% customer satisfaction, give me a break.

I think the assumption is that a mobile user will only do a few things and move on. Certainly they do cancel users for excessive usage, that's well documented.

The contract doesn't specify movement. It specifically says it can't be used for landline replacement, stationary installations, and a few other similar words. I really don't know if they'd enforce this. I do know they have enforced limits of usage. I think that's their primary concern.

Yep, which is why EVDO and UMTS are not a very good broadband option, especially given the sprectrum limitations; which is probably why they even have such a ridiculous SLA.

I'm still pushing for 75% FTTH by 2010, who is with me?!?! hahaha :)

Do you have any idea what the time limitation is for Verizon EVDO? An hour at a time? I really don't need to be online all the time, just a few hours a day at most.

I've never seen any indication that time is an issue; it's total data transfer. The magic number I've heard very often is about 200mb/month. Lots of people report getting warnings around that level, and a lot were summarily cancelled when they hit double that.

This is all from user reports on howardforums.com and pdaphonehome.com, and not from the providers. Neither Sprint nor Verizon will say what the limit on "unlimited" actually is, since they'd rather lie and say it's unlimited.

BTW, T-Mobile has never been reported to drop someone for excess use (that I've ever seen anyway). However the actual speeds on their network are more in the line of 140k.

But I don't understand: if they don't specify any limit how can they penalize you for "excessive" use?

Deep in the fine print of the TOS, they say that the use must be "reasonable" and "typical" and such things, then go on to say you can't use it as a landline replacement and such. It says you can't use it excessively or "impact other users and the network." How are you going to fight this? Can you afford to go to court against Verizon? Besides, the most you could get is to avoid paying the cancellation fee, since the TOS also says they can cancel you for any reason or no reason.

Why hasn't the FTC clamped down on the outright lie of saying "unlimited??" The same thing happens with VoIP and "free" long distance by the way. Normally a VoIP carrier's "unlimited" service is for up to 3000 minutes, same with most "unlimited" LD.

Lies or marketing?

Well, we know whose side the FTC and FCC are on, so no surprise there. I still think EVDO could be a viable option since I don't need to use up much bandwidth.

Thanks again, y'all.

Good luck with it Justins7.