Just moved to mac recently and I love it.

aantn, welcome to mac!

I have just returned to my job as an interior designer after a year off designing magazines and the head accountant (aged 65) who was MR. Windows XP before I left took great pleasure in telling me he had his 20" imac on order!!! What ever next I thought... then he pulled his ipod mini of his pocket!!

I almost fell over! :D

The problem is that so many windows user are completely unaware. They just dont even realize that there is another alternative. Apple has to put out ads that show OS X. People dont realize how much better the GUI is, and how much more stable it is. I showed a friend expose and minimized a windows in slow motion (by the way ctrl shift minimizes even slower than shift) and his eyes popped out of his head.

If each mac user could convince 1 windows user to swtich...

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I think Apple should make a convincing "soft Mac" demo for Windows, so the Windows hostages can get a glimpse of freedom (forgive the hyperbole) and try out the GUI.

Beauty seduces; elegance lures; the power of practicality invites full attention; the virus-free environment should clinch the deal!

– ArcticStones

Then Mac market share would double from 4% to 8%, and Windows would be "down" to 92% instead of 96%. Hm. We'll need to do many times better than convincing one user each.

Welcome aantn
 

Welcome aantn, i hope you would enjoy your new Mac and the community.

No always true. Linux distros offer way more options that windows, and are usually a few years ahead. For example all the new features in vista, were already available in linux for about the last two years. Linux is probably the most ahead and on top of the times OS out there, but its not the most commonly used. Linux pretty much runs the internet, but when it comes to end users its not used very much. Why is this? If Linux is so much more advanced than pretty much all the other OSes out there, then why is it not used. I can see why mac os x is not used because of the PPC enviroment and hardware costs are higher. Linux will run on x86 and its free or requires minimal site liscences for support, and the cost is way lower than microsoft. So, linux is cheaper and more powerful but used way less, why is that?

It is because microsoft makes their OSes easy to use. Sure you can complain about migrating an exchange server, or upgrading from win2k advance server to win2k3 server. Win2k3 sever has lots of new terminal services features allowing more robust remote log in and remote management. Linux has offered that for years now (as well as unix). But then again you are the only one doing this stuff if you work in IT. If you are an end user you don't care how hard it is to migrate servers, or do any kind of server side work. you just want it to work. Windows is freaking easy to use, reguardless of how crappy you think it is, it is the easiest OS to use out there. Mac OS X is extremely easy imo as well, but I would say the masses find windows easier to use.

I use both mac os x and windows (as well as linux) and the reason why windows is so popular is because its just easy to use. In the end its all about the user. The end user makes you money, they keep your company generating revenue. The IT/Admins just make sure the end user can be productive on their systems. In my current job we run all three enviroments and the macintosh systems only hold around a 5% population out of the 10,000 computers we have for end users. It has been pretty consistant with about 5 ~ 7% total popluation, with the rest being PCs running windows. We also run novell, which IMO is not needed because Wink2k3 server can do pretty much everything novell can. I will say that iprint from novell is pretty sweet, and I like how it works. Again novell is pretty easy to use, and its gui set up is pretty simple in windows. I learned how to set full contexts, and trees, and how NDS works, and how to map drives through commands, etc in about 2 days with no prior novell training. It was that easy.

So, honestly, if apple can fill the gap between a great OS and easy to use interface (which they have for the most part imo) the the flexibility of hardware (like MS) then I see it being a major challenge. If they decide to keep all their hardware propritary(sp?) I foresee that limiting them. This is just my view from an IT workers perspective. When we do all of our major purchasing for the year and base our budgets of previous ones we look at what works and is most cost effective. The PCs work and they are cheaper, and we can get more of them so everyone can have a PC. The macs are for specific labs (like video editing, computer animation, etc) and are only purchased for certain specialized things. However, we have PCs that run those things too. I would like to see apple just release an OS that would run on just about any x86 configuration, so I could freaking dual boot windows and mac os x on any system I build. That is what I want.

I hardly think so. If anything, what you are talking about a familiarity effect.

Just as an aside - if you enable "Check Spelling as You Type" in Safari's Edit/Spelling menu, then you won't need to use that "sp?" ever again when posting to forums.

I think what you mean is that you can get along with cheaper machines (very low end models - a market that Apple doesn't address) either because your workers aren't worth spending the money on and/or because your support costs come out of a different budget than your capital expenditures.

Never seen that before... :D

That's hilarious, given the number of switchers on this site alone, who are often afraid to try something on their Mac for fear of 'breaking' it. Most of the masses I've seen are even afraid to install software on their PCs, which explains the number of noobie questions about "uninstaller" software for the Mac. :D

Nope I am saying that from an IT perspective hayne. I have supported both and been an independant contractor at times (and I still am for macs on the side) for support for both. Most of my clients have always been majority windows users, so IME, the masses seem to like windows better. Microsoft holds a larger share in the market blah blah blah. I am not debating over whether macs are good or bad machines, I am saying apple should change how they do business to reach more users.

It is my guess that with the new x86 macs coming out and with OS X's superior security and limited virus vulnerability, it could make microsoft make a run for its money. I think that if apple did just become an OS/software company they could do better for themselves and put in a broader hardware support. So manufacturers can preload OS X with their systems and you could go out and build your own system and have a choice to run mac os x, or win xp, or dual boot them both.

I think that if apple wants to be a big contender like MS, they would need to do business more like microsoft. This is something most mac users do not want to see, but I do. I want to be able to build my own system with my own hardware (intel or AMD) and be able to load OS X on it. Apple may never do this, but IMO, it would get them more business. It would open the door for all the PC users that get fed up with windows and don't want to change out their hardware. Or to get even crazier, what if dell, HP, and sony started making PCs with mac os x on it?

Perhaps I am the only person on this forum who thinks this, because I am not soley an elitist either way versus microsoft over mac os x. I do however wish it was more of an even market and everyone had their fair market share. A little competition always makes it better for the consumer, and makes it better for the IT workers also in some ways.

Also, apple just tackled the low end market with the mac mini, so you cannot tell me they aren't looking for the simple cheaper (lower end) users. I mean if you have a group of users in your company that mainly use office, email and internet, why would you go buy a mac when you can get a PC at half the cost? Looking at it from a business perspective is what its about, its all business. I have worked on the sales side of support, supporting sales reps and their customer's with hardware/software support in the past. when someone came to me for a business solution they almost always wanted the most cost effective, and don't try to counter-argue with the mac never breaks down line. i worked for an AASP for years and had broken macs on my work bench every day. They break down all the time.

Bottom line, is I want apple to become bigger and have a larger market share, it would make me more valuable of an employee have been supporting both sides for years, and it would make the market more competitive.

Just my opinion on stuff though, please don't anyone take any of this personally.

Higher management spending tons in the wrong place just cause they don't know their head from their feet in IT ? That's never happened in any place I work ! :D
Only in every place I don't work anymore ;)

And by the way, I completely agree with tlarkin on the expansion Apple should do towards opening themselves to a broader range of hardware so you could build your machine and have OS X work on x86 architecture in general. But as nice start would be if they joined in a company such as Dell or HP, etc so those companies would offer a version of OS X as an alternative to windows when the customer's buying...Abit in the same way some stores and companies have started to offer Linux as a second OS choice.

And to still add to the point... The Mini is a great idea as well. I've convinced a few people to switch just cause of that one with the price and size !

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This is a most inspiring thread! From observations, news nuggets and personal experiences in the posts here, it certainly appears that Macs are making significant headway.

Now that’s encouraging! :)
I would love to see some reliable figures (haven’t yet).

With best regards,
ArcticStones

To an accuracy of 3 decimals, the market of people who want to build their own machines is 0.000 % of the total.
And the amount of available profit if Apple owned 100% of that market is (in millions of dollars): 0.000

I am not sure where you have that info, but the contract work I do on the side is for an onsite company based in a retail store, and they get a lot of custom build PC work orders in. Infact walk into a computer store lots of them have a build it yourself section. It has to be larger than that, and if its not it will be in the future. A good friend of mine works in a mutli-millin dollar design firm with approx 170ish users with around a 50/50 mac pc enviroment. All of their PCs are custom built, all of them. They are built for specific usage, like video editing, photo work, whatever it may be. Lots of companies are building PCs customly for their specialized departments.

Not to mention if you were able to load OS X on any PC, think of how many people would be tempted to switch.

Apple lost money in the early 90s to their clones because other companies were able to produce macintosh hardware cheaper than apple was, and they were losing business. IMHO, mac clones were a great idea it was just implemented wrong, and they lost money over it. I even have a mac clone sitting around somewhere in my parents basement. I'll have to go back there to get it one of these days.

Actually, I think it's going to be the other way around. If you could load MS Windows on any (future) Apple machine, think of how many people would be tempted to switch (to Apple hardware, and probably eventually also to OS X).

But remember, Apple is a company and hence it's not about the numbers, it's about the amount of profit. Currently most of Apple's profit still comes from sales of Macintosh hardware. It is likely to remain that way for a while. Apple is doing just fine with its current business model.

yeah you are right about their hardware profits, but apple has generated more revenue in the ipod, online music store business last few years. They are making their money in other places. I think once they test the waters with the intel based macs they will be more ready to jump into a new business model.

Of course you could be right and people could be wanting to switch to apple hardware to run their windows machines, but since its all intel based (intel mb, intel chipset, etc) they could always probably find a way to build it cheaper. Plus someone might want to use the via or nforce, or whatever chipset instead on their board. However, I will stop there and not get too ahead of myself since that would be bit ways off.

I will agree with you that it will open up a whole new market and we won't be able to tell whats going to happen until it happens. I am just hoping it goes the way I described earlier.

I mean do you totally disagree that being able to load OS X on any x86 PC would really honestly be that bad of a thing? Look at Lindows, it is being offered on several manufacturers machines now for being preisntalled. Its not anywhere as popular as mac os x or windows, but some peole are switching to the linux based enviroment of lindows. Its not making any huge impact or anything, but what if apple did that. Imagine someone calling dell to place an order and having the option of windows or mac os x?

That would drastically change the market IMHO, but I don't want to argue with anyone so I'll just stop here. I think I have expressed my opinion well enough.

Bad for whom?
I think it would be bad for Apple - as I've explained above, they make most of their money by selling hardware. And Apple's stated position is that they will do everything they can to prevent OS X from running on non-Apple hardware.

But that's like saying that 90% of Windows users prefer Windows. Until they are selling the OS separately, of course they won't be making much money selling the OS. Windows XP Pro sells for $350; you think OS X is worth that much? Even at half the price it's still more than they sell it for to Apple hardware users.

Yup that is because Apple is not quite in the OS selling business yet. XP Pro costs $300.00 I thought for full and $150.00 for the upgrade? I am wrong on that? I think you make a good point if someone was custom building a PC and saw OS X for 129.99 or winxp for 299.99 they may go with OS X. Good observation on that one CAlvarez, I didn't even think that mac os x was already cheaper.

However, MS makes a killing of a profit on site liscenses too, imagine if apple sold 10,000 lisceneses to a corporation to run on pre existing hardware, that was non apple?