Dock "Layer"
 

Is there any way of having the Dock at the bottom-most layer? In other words, I'd like to have windows move OVER the dock instead of them sliding underneath.

This seems to be tied to the other irritation that I can't make a window, like Firefox, larger (like full screen) because the Dock prevents me...it's as if the Dock, to Firefox, is the bottom of the screen.

I do NOT want to hide my Dock though...just be able to move windows and allow them to cover it.

Thanks!

This can be annoying, especially on 13" screens. I usually put the Dock on one side to get around it.

I've always kept my dock high on the left-hand edge of my screen.

I have the same problem. Moving/hiding the dock is NOT a solution, folks. Anyone else know a workaround?

The whole point of the Dock is that it is something which is always available (no matter which application is active). So putting the Dock under some other application would defeat the purpose.

Hiding the Dock is the solution.

Agreed. Command-option-D works from any app, plus it automatically unhides (if hidden) when the cursor reaches the edge of the screen. Actually... in my case, the Dock always stays visible as a thin strip way over on the right-hand side. But occasional hiding is always an easy 3-finger shortcut away.

Allowing the Dock to be covered up by numerous windows would actually be *more* of a hassle. [how can than not be totally obvious?]

Sigh. I guess it's maybe too much to expect for people to read entire threads?

I understand that some of you might not be able to imagine a scenario wherein you would want to have a window over the dock. That's fine--but that is the question of this thread. Saying "the thing (hiding the dock) that you don't want to do is what you should do" is the opposite of helpful.

So, to help people conceptualize what MY issue is (I can't speak for the OP) and perhaps to help people see that there are lots of different ways to use OS X, here's my current layout:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2646/...4f2da65e_b.jpg

You notice the gap at the bottom of the screen? This is what happens when i open any program--it defaults the bottom of the window at the top of the dock. Firefox (and most other programs) remember the last position of the window when you close the program, and then when you reopen the program, it opens the window in the last place. That is, unless you move the window below the dock line--then, on relaunch, the program disregards the last position and moves the window to the top of the dock. That's the problem. Yes, hiding the dock makes the gap go away, but it doesn't allow me to see what programs i've got active (and other things i use my dock for).

Here's what would ideally happen when i opened a new window in Firefox after moving it down past the "dock barrier" previously:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2445/...99927919_b.jpg

So, again, the question: Does anyone know how to make the windowing system in OS X ignore the "Dock Barrier"?

We all know. It can't be done. Why do you need to know what programs are running?

All sarcasm aside, thank you for your input. However, just cause you don't know a way doesn't mean it can't be done.

It is certainly possible (and the more i search, the more i agree) that such an option is not built into OS X, but a more helpful way to put it would have been, "I don't know a way for that to be done."

I'm hoping someone who knows X11 really well might be able to suggest a terminal-based solution (or something along those lines). Hell, you might be really well versed in X11, and that's why you said "It can't be done," but some justification or explanation of why you say that would be more helpful.

I use the dock to manage active programs and to move documents into open programs (pulling additional .jpg's into an already open instance of Word or Photoshop). But, again, WHY I want to do this isn't in question. The thread isn't "How else can I manage my .jpg's and see what programs are open?" :)

You didn't ask if "I" know. You asked if "anyone" knows. Unfortunately, nobody can answer that question. One can only answer for themselves.

You seem to be under a misapprehension that X11 (a windowing system used on Linux and other Unix variants, and available as an option on OS X) is somehow relevant to this issue. It is not. Neither is Unix per-se - the problem is solely related to OS X's GUI layer and its window manager.

Actually, it is. The "why" of a query is often the most important part - especially when you are asking for something unusual.

I did give a smart answer. But the rationale you gave is something that the Dock excels at that, even when hidden. Give it a try.

Otherwise, the only solution I can think of is to connect a second display and do your work on the monitor without the Dock.

Why are you answering for everyone then?

@hayne: Ah, my ignorance about how OS X is programmed shines through :) I was (mistakenly) under the impression that X11 was the name for the GUI manager.

The reason I say that the why isn't important is because I don't want suggestions on other things to do (ie--hide the dock, use a second monitor, etc...) that do not help answer my question. I have an idea in my head, and that's the question I have. While the why is certainly important, forumers seem to focus on that instead of on the question at hand.

@chabig: I hid the dock for a while at first, but it didn't work as well for me. Thx for the suggestion a third time, though :)

Ah - but the reason the "why" is important is that you may be asking the wrong question.
E.g. you probably don't really care ultimately about the position of the Dock - what you care about is some other way of accomplishing your work (a higher-level goal) and if you explained this higher-level goal, maybe someone could find a way of accomplishing it.

(It's like if I asked "How do I stop my scissors from getting jammed up with bark?" when what I really should have asked was "How can I cut down a tree?")

OK then--to reiterate:

I want to be able to tell a program to ignore the "dock barrier" that prevents it from positioning a window below the top of the dock.

I want to do this because the way my dock is positioned on my screen, it takes up a minimal amount of space but still allows me to see what programs i have open at a glance. I want to be able to use up the part of the screen that the dock does not occupy to have more of my programs visible. For reference, see earlier post with pictures.

You can put a piece of masking tape over the Dock so you'll think the window extends to the bottom of the screen...

There's something really odd about those pictures in post #8. How does it happen that the *application* icons are all scrunched toward the right? That's where folders and Stacks usually go. [Where are your stacks btw?] By default, Finder's icon should be all the way in the lower left corner. Is there some haxie that's doing that... or are we talking Photoshop here?

If those app icons in that photo were in their proper locations... and if windows were allowed to cover the Dock... then, you wouldn't be able to "glance" at the Dock to see what apps were running. [to wit: having my dock positioned on the right side does have its advantages.]

So what's the deal with those photos? If that's a haxie shifting the icons to the right, then perhaps the author of that haxie can code a solution for you.


Other than that (and since i don't see any Stacks), i have two more words to offer: Drag Thing

I don't think it is at all likely that you will be able to do that since as far as I know, the way it goes is like this:
When an application wants to open a new window, it asks the OS (via an API for this purpose) what is the available area excluding the Dock. Then it calculates what size to make its window.
I.e. the size & positioning of the window is under the control of the application. Apple recommends that applications should avoid the Dock area and so most OS X apps do so.
But unless you have access to the source code of an app, you are unlikely to find a way to make it behave differently.

I see.
I would rephrase your question to:
"How can I make the Dock's reserved area be restricted to a certain horizontal region (as opposed to the whole width of the screen)?"
I doubt that this is possible.

That looks like a normal Dock to me, just positioned on the right side of the screen. It's a feature of the Dock, but not accessible through the GUI.

Is it a secret, or can you point to how it's done? ;)

Anyway, i have over 30 items in my Dock at any given time (not running mind you, but apps ready to launch, 5 Stacks, etc). That photo shows only 7 running apps and a trash can!!! :D So the Dock is just a process monitor??? No way José.

I know Onyx can do it. You can do it with Terminal (don't know the command). TinkerTool probably does it, and other system utilities.

You could rewrite the Dock.app in your /System/Library/CoreSystems folder to allow it to sit behind windows. There is no way to "trick" it since that is an intrical part of the program.

That is very useful. Thanks for the explanation--and you're right, it's starting to sound like it's not possible to tell an already compiled program to ignore the dock barrier.

This doesn't really capture it, though. I don't want the reserved area to be restricted to just that area--i want it to be gone. I think that trying to specify "only a certain portion of the reserved area is actually reserved" is much more complicated (from a coding standpoint) than "ignore all the dock's reserved area." Hence my earlier question.

@LasVegas--do you know how to do this? or are you throwing it out there. I'm no coder; reprogramming more than a simple boolean value or copy-paste-modify terminal command is outside my abilities.

@Hal--yeah, i don't use stacks--i'm more of a keyboard navigator, so i use Quicksilver (with a deeper-than-default nesting) to move files to where i want them, or recall them from where i put them. So, yeah, unless i'm really working up a storm with different multimedia apps, I mostly use the dock as a process monitor (especially when working while using Transmission). As you might have noticed from the 4 different system monitoring widgets in my menu bar, i'm a bit of a control freak.

And, as far as me photoshopping those pics just to prove a point? I waste enough time worrying about silly things like saving 1/2 an inch of my screen area, so I suppose that isn't necessarily far fetched. :) Dock position managed through Superdocker, transparency from Mirage.

I'm not trying to be a jerk here, but if the Dock is just being used to monitor active processes, why not just hide it and rely on the application list shown with the Command-Tab switcher?

Using Command-Tab followed by Command-Escape will show active processes without leaving whatever is currently frontmost. This also seems like it would be an easy transition for someone who is self-described as "more of a keyboard navigator."

@Sodium hydroxide--that's a fair question. That's actually exactly what I did when I used to hide the dock. But now I just prefer to have it there at a glance--so, even if i'm typing or reading something on screen, it's just a flick of my eyes to see what's going on on my machine (same logic for my menu-bar monitors).

Also, no one asked, but the menubar system monitor i have going there is atMonitor. It's one of the most specific and customizable system monitors out there--there aren't a lot of menubar based monitors that have GPU temperature! but atMonitor does (and more). And the developers are top notch--I've emailed them twice with bugs i've found in the 6 months i've been using it, and both times they've fixed it and released an update within the week (once it was less than a full day later!). Again, I know no one asked, but I thought i'd throw a little love their way--it's the best system monitoring app i've found.

Sounds good.

Have you tried working with the Dock on the right side much? It's the only place i like it, and I think that would be a really simple solution for you. If you think about it: by scrunching those icons all the way on the right, you're already half way there. So take the next logical step and just put the whole goshdarn Dock on the right. The height problem gets totally solved, and replaced by a (much less troublesome) tiny loss of width.

My Dock is on the left side.

@hal--i tried that, too. My thought process was similar. However, the dock then moves anything subsequently loaded to my desktop a half-inch to the left--new items can't break the dock barrier, either.

Current desktop icons: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3478/...f0b27ee3_b.jpg

With dock on right: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3481/...e19ab630_b.jpg

Again, we're only talking a 1/2 an inch here, but for someone with more than mild OCD, it's frustrating.

(PS--i know the icon's don't immediately/automatically shift over that 1/2 inch--but anytime i mount a .dmg/external drive or download something to the desktop, it does shift that icon over--so instead of a nice grid of icons, it's a zig-zag of different placement.)

Here's a workaround for these recent workarounds. Position the Dock on the right. Also, install Camouflage, which will visually hide all Desktop items, thus making the system shifting of these items inconsequential. Then you can simply access Desktop items by opening the Desktop folder (Command-Shift-D).

:rolleyes: Seriously? :eek: [This is getting ridonkulous.]

Just move Zooey (and the other preexisting icons) to the left a tad, so they snap to the new grid.

@NaOH--Hmm, that would totally work if having things on the desktop is a large part of my workflow. Never seen that program before, though--thanks for the hint.

@hal--Sigh. I know it's ridiculous. I've tried the icon thing, and it just sets off my OCD. I appreciate the thought, though.

I've posted a link to the Secrets google group. Maybe someone more familiar with some of the underlying code/.plist stuff might have a suggestion. I'll be sure to post back here if I hear of any way to disable the dock barrier.

I may suggest then, followung the preceding post and the first picture, giving a look at Greasemonkey just in case you'd be able to workaround for firefox...

If this is true, then perhaps there is a way to get the Dock to "lie" whenever an app asks what space is available? If the Dock told Firefox that it is currently only taking up 1px or that it is hidden, then perhaps Firefox and any other apps would then freely take up the entire screen.

Although "Layer" wise, they would still be "under" the Dock, just as newly opened apps who remembered their last position can somtimes find themselves under the Dock. That won't be an issue though with your current Dock placement though.